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Guildhall (Assassin Dice)

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Dristan
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Joined: 07/05/2012

I would love to get some feedback from the community on a game concept I've been working on. I've been playtesting the current version for a while myself but It still feels like something is missing to me.

The basic concept of this game sprung from the desire to craft an asymmetrical dice game wherein the players had to make a decision. Do they devote all of their units to attacking the “PvE” contract die in an attempt to get as many victory points as possible or split their units between attacking the contract die and engaging in “PvP” with other players in an attempt to slow down their acquisition of victory points.

Premise Of The Game: In the great city of Arakon many guilds exist but one is feared and respected above all. That of the Assassin’s Guild. For many years under the leadership of master Yolan Kale the guild has prospered. However, even the greatest assassin cannot outwit death himself. Yolan fell to the ravages of time and in doing so, left a power void squarely at the top of his organization.

This is where you come in, as his most trusted lieutenants it falls to one of you to take up the mantle of leadership. The only question is... which one of you will ascend to the position of leader and who will have to die before you hold it securely?


Basic game elements:
• Players 2-4 (Can be expanded to 2-8 players but the amount of dice become unwieldy for packing and pricing purposes)
• 12x D6 Unit Die (4 sets of 3)
• 1x D20 Contract Die
• 20x Victory Point Counters

Unit Die [D6]
1. Assault
2. Assault (Reroll)
3. Stealth
4. Stealth (Reroll)
5. Snipe
6. Snipe (Reroll)

The unit dice are meant to represent the assassin that remain loyal to you. When they are attacking they have three methods of assaulting their target. For gameplay these are represented by swords (Assault), poison bottle (Stealth), and a bow & arrow (Snipe). These have a similar powers to classic rock, paper, scissors with the order of power being Assault>Stealth>Snipe>Assault...

All even numbers are reroll sides. You may reroll them and add whatever you get to your total tally. For example if a contract requires you to roll 2 assault and you get 1 Assault (Reroll) + 2 Snipes on your first cast, you may roll the assault (reroll) die again. If the result is another assault you will have reached the required 2 Assaults and successfully completed the contract.

Contract Die [D20]
1. 1 Assault Contract
2. 2 Assault Contract
3. 2 Assault Contract
4. 3 Assault Contract
5. 1 Stealth Contract
6. 2 Stealth Contract
7. 2 Stealth Contract
8. 3 Stealth Contract
9. 1 Snipe Contract
10. 2 Snipe contract
11. 2 Snipe Contract
12. 3 Snipe Contract
13. Clash
14. Clash
15. Clash
16. Clash
17. Clash
18. Alliance (5 Assault)
19. Alliance (5 Stealth)
20. Alliance (5 Snipe)


Setup
• Each Player gets three unit dice
• Each Player gets one victory point

How To Play

  1. Current player allocates his three units in the manner he wishes, split between attempting to successfully complete a contract and intercepting enemy assassins. You can dedicate your three units to attack as many enemy players as you wish.

  2. Player rolls the contract die

  3. Player attempts to successfully fulfil the requirements of the contract. If result is....
    1,2 or 3 “Method” Side (Assault, Snipe or Stealth): then you must roll the appropriate number of opposite methods with your remaining units. For example, if the Contract die comes up on 2 Stealth the player must roll a total of 2 assaults before his unit actions are expended to claim the victory point.
    Clash: then the player can recall all declared units from the field and engage in a roll-off with another player of his choosing. Clash combat is resolved by players rolling one unit against each other at a time. Each time a unit is defeated it is taken out of play for the duration of the clash. If both players roll the same method then both dice are rerolled. The victor in the clash can then steal a victory point from the other player’s hoard. If you attack a player with no victory points a successfull clash will remove them from the game.
    Alliance: then the current player may choose an ally. Once an ally has been chosen both players roll their armies together and attempt to get 5 successful attacks. If the attack succeeds then both players get a victory point.

  4. Any declared attacks on other players are resolved.
    • Roll off against enemy unit dice one at at time. Repeat for each unit you have sent to attack.
    • If your unit is victorious their defending unit is taken out of play until the end of their next turn.
    • If their unit is victorious your unit is recalled with no penalty to you.

  5. Game continues until a player collects 5 victory points.

[EDITS]______________________
• 07.12.12 – Updated Alliance rules

ReluctantPirateGames
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Joined: 09/27/2011
Possible dice idea

So this looks really great. And despite the fact that I would rather not have to compete against it, I want to suggest that you consider a quick re-theme so you can enter it into the current Game Crafter competition. I don't know if you've used the site before, but this game would basically be perfect as is for that contest (Steampunk Dice).

Anyway, I was looking at your contract system and I though it could be adjusted to work with two d6 instead of a d20 and a guide sheet. You would have to adjust your odds a bit, but it could be made to work. Here's how I worked it out:

The first die would be similar to the unit die.
Stealth 1 - Stealth 2 - Assault 1 - Assault 2 - Snipe 1 - Snipe 2

The second die would be a little different.
Stealth - Assault - Snipe - Contract - Contract - Contract +1

Rolling a pair of like attack crests results in an Alliance. Rolling a pair of unlike crests results in a Clash. Contracts are just simple addition. Add the value of the contract (0 or 1) to the value of the attack crest (1 or 2). This will yield slightly different odds than you originally intended, but it still works out pretty well. The contract spread is 1-1-2-2-2-3.

So yeah, that's my only suggestion. I know the feeling when you think your game is just "missing something," but I'm not sure what this game needs. I thought maybe eliminating the d20 and replacing it with more d6s might do something for it. But you should really give some thought to the Game Crafter contest. You just need to make this steampunk somehow.

fecundity
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Joined: 07/28/2008
Since the different outcomes

Since the different outcomes are symmetrical, there is no difference in probability of success between a 2 Stealth contract and a 2 Snipe contract; similarly for different alliance goals. Although the player looks for different die faces, they are just window dressing.

Imagine a different game in which you roll a bunch of standard dice, such that sometimes you want a lot of 1s and sometimes you want a lot of 6s. If you decide which to pursue after your first roll and can then reroll some dice, then there's a meaningful difference. If you just flip a coin to determine whether you are aiming for 1s or 6s, then there isn't. In the latter case, it would be easier to skip the coin flip and always be aiming for 1s.

So I think that there ought to be something to break the symmetry. Maybe different objectives could score a different number of points. Maybe players can manipulate some outcomes but not others, possibly with special powers from their assassin clan. Or something else.

Note that the PvP roshambo part isn't just a matter of wanting to roll 1s all the time, but it is similarly symmetrical. Some kind of symmetry breaking would be nice.

As an aside: To make it steampunk, have the assassins be secret ninjas in the service of Queen Victoria. (All the ninja who left during the Meiji restoration had to go somewhere, right?)

Traz
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Joined: 04/06/2009
go pirates!

Reluctant Pirate - you hit it! Thanks for doing all the brain work for me - that was making me crazy.... As soon as I read through the rules, I started trying to think of how he could change all his dice to D6's - this will make the game INFINITELY more marketable!

You can even have the game easily [and REASONABLY] produced with all D6s. Just contact Steve Jones @ BLUE PANTHER. He can laser cut [or full color ink on wooden dice] your D6s for a very reasonable price and you could be selling this by the end of next month.

Seriously.

But - I HEARTILY suggest making cool icons for each of the die faces. Just words would seem bland.

I think you need to include a full turn example between three players in your rulebook. There are a couple of concepts that just don't jump out at me.

Having published a design where the only bits are dice, I can tell you I think it's an AWESOME place to go! Good luck!

Dristan
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Joined: 07/05/2012
A big Thanks to Everyone

Thank you to everyone who contributed to the discussion. All of you have made excellent points and helped me to quantify what was throwing me off about the game concept.

I think it's take this one back to the drawing board and let it incubate for a bit longer. I'm going to mess around with a few other ideas for adding some player interaction (perhaps even deviating from my purely dice restrictions) and see if I can't push the theme to the forefront. The dice idea (or at least the varient that I have now) just isn't providing the level of interest that I'm shooting for.

Cheers!

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