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Just an Average hello!

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ManAverage
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Joined: 11/07/2012

Hello all, I'm ManAverage hailing from the not so sunny shores of the UK. I've been lurking on here and board game geek for a few months reading the advice and decided it was probably time to start contributing (aka asking questions) about the board game creation process.

Originally my idea was for a computer game, after attempting to learn a coding language I came to the conclusion it was way too much undertaking for just myself and converted it into a board game (Which seems to have gone down well with my limited number of playtesters)

Currently I have three games, two concept and one which is in the process of obtaining IP protection as I intend to self publish to the hobby games market (I am realistic about my chances, breaking even on any investment would be fantastic) and I'm aiming to be at the UK games expo retailing by 2014.

So yeah, that's me. Just your Average Man... Average.

Dralius
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Im not familiar with UK IP

Im not familiar with UK IP law, what protection are you seeking and why?

RAVaught
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IP Laws

I am not familiar with the UK IP laws, but there is a fairly common understanding about protecting your IP when making a game.

First, you will need to register and literary or artistic items with the copyright office. That covers the specific artwork and specific wording such as your rule book and any the specific wording of any written component of your game.

Second, you would need to register your particular combination of mechanics with the patent office. It will only protect you from direct duplication of your mechanics, not similar ones.

You will need to look up the specific process on your governments Copyright/Patent laws to find out the process though. There will generally be a nominal fee involved. If you are really, really concerned, get a legal advice from a lawyer. A small investment that could potentially save you a bundle down the road.

Dralius
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RAVaught wrote:First, you

RAVaught wrote:
First, you will need to register and literary or artistic items with the copyright office. That covers the specific artwork and specific wording such as your rule book and any the specific wording of any written component of your game.

Second, you would need to register your particular combination of mechanics with the patent office. It will only protect you from direct duplication of your mechanics, not similar ones.

In the US copywrite is automatic, that is as soon as you write it, it is copywrited <-Already copywrited text by David E. Whitcher

It’s true that a filed copywrite will help you in court should someone copy you but copywrite only protects the expression of your work not the idea. Clue, Battle Ships, Monopoly, Stratego, etc… all have clones with unique art and a differently written rules which under the law is legal. Even a multibillion dollar company like Hasbro is powerless to stop these rip-offs.

The issue of patents is another thing. If you have a mechanical device that is unique and there is cause to think you will recoup the expense of the patent might be worth it. Plus should someone infringe on the patent you’ll need the money to go to court which makes the patent application fees look like chump change.

BubbleChucks
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Hiya I’m from the UK and I

Hiya

I’m from the UK and I know a little bit about protecting your original creations over here.

The previous advice is pretty much spot on the money

Copyright exists as soon as you make public your idea with the little copyright symbol. It doesn’t offer a whole lot of protection, but it offers some.

Obtaining a patent for your idea will cost a small fortune and entail a very lengthy process. Having obtained a patent it WILL cost you even more to defend it. And it’s debatable whether your chance of success warrants the defense (irrespective of the other party being at fault).

Board games are still a grey area when it comes to protection. The appearance of a game can be protected quite easily. However, the mechanics are very difficult to protect. It’s all nonsense really and the system is hopelessly out of date.

To anyone with a working knowledge of board games the mechanic is what defines a game and the resulting game play. The theme or appearance is, more often than not, secondary in importance. The majority of consumers buy a game for the game play and not as an object or collection of objects to look at. So it would seem to make sense to focus on the element that the buyers of the product are actually buying.

However, assessing the uniqueness of collected game mechanics is a lot more difficult and time consuming than assessing something that can be viewed with the naked eye. I would hazard to guess that the reason for the current system of authentication is purely one of simplicity over actual merit.

The system becomes more bizarre when you look at some of the things that can be protected and the similarity they have to the board game or video game model.

A musical score can be protected, even though it is in essence the same stock notes arranged in an original combination to create a unique sound. The visual representation of this sound is demonstrated in physical form by the notations on a music sheet.

However, anyone with an awareness of music will know that Mozarts musical score sheets do not adequately convey the composers full intentions for the piece and many different variations are possible from the same score – while keeping true to the musical notations.

So the orchestration of notes on a music sheet can be viewed as an objective re-imagining of stock notes, even though it can be interpreted in numerous ways. The music sheet stands as the written source to be protected and the sound is the resulting output when used.

In comparison a rule sheet, comprised of letters arranged to physically communicate orchestrated game play, is denied protection, because it is only accorded the status of an idea.

Why the unique grouping of game mechanics, as portrayed in a set of game rules, is denied the same protection is beyond me. Unfortunately, that’s how it is with game protection.

That being said, protection for a game is possible. It’s one of the reasons why game publishers add their own artwork. This gives them something they can protect in terms of visual appearance and the protection can be gained relatively quickly and cheaply.

Cheap isn’t a word that is often associated with protection (ask the warrior with the card stock armour), but when you take into account the realistic financial returns for a game then cheap is the realisic way to go. If the game becomes a smash hit then adding further protection at a later date may be an option, and any existing protection will make the process a lot easier.

So what is available in terms of cheap protection for an idea/product?

First up, cheapest and least protection is a copyright – which is free and only involves the public expression of an idea in written form.

The next one is a Trademark. If you Trademark the name of your game it will stop anyone else from using the same name for another ‘game’ related product. If you are looking to make a series of games or you have the intention of releasing expansions to develop a product range then a Trademark will also help to protect the developing brand. A Trademark will also offer benefits in relation to licensing your game.

The next option is a Registered Design. This protects the appearance of your game and anything that can be seen. This type of protection will cover the visual elements of your game, such as game components, layout and artwork – making it difficult for anyone to directly copy your game.

However, a Registered Design doesn’t protect any internal workings that can’t be seen by simply looking at the product in its given state (which can sometimes apply to internal workings). This is why it can be a good idea to submit product applications where pictures/representations of the product are taken from a source with a transparent outer casing – and subsequent products are produced with the normal retail casing.

Both of these options will grant the game some protection and they can be acquired relatively quickly and for very little expense. When applying for these forms of protection the designer can also opt for National coverage, European coverage or Worldwide coverage – each having a different price point.

RAVaught
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Yup

Dralius wrote:

In the US copywrite is automatic, that is as soon as you write it, it is copywrited <-Already copywrited text by David E. Whitcher

Yes, but it is kind of flimsy, really. Which is why I didn't focus on that too much. Even the 'poor man's copyright'(mailing a sealed package to yourself) offers some measure of coverage, but neither offer as much as actually filing it.

Stormyknight1976
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Welcome

Welcome to the community ManAverage.

Martin-r-m
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Protection

Hi,

in my opinion a simple way to protect a name is to register the name at the internet. www.mygamename.com and www.mygamename.eu can be registered for some $ and you will need them anyway. You now can proof the date of registration and the use of this name for a game.
The low level of copyright is not negative. You, as a small selfpublisher would loose any lawsuit started by the big players in this buisness. Ravensburger, Hasbro and so on would keep 100 lawyers and control all game mechanics and kick you out of the buisness....

ManAverage
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Responses galore!

Thanks for the responses guys.

Dralius wrote:

Im not familiar with UK IP law, what protection are you seeking and why?

I have a local IP organisation in my area which offers free advice and assistance to inventors etc. They have sent me some information about which types of protection are available and which are best to suit my needs as well as recommended independent IP solicitors. I have a meeting arranged with them in January to show the completed design, at which point they are able to point me in the right direction for the best protection.

BubbleChucks wrote:
Hiya

I’m from the UK and I know a little bit about protecting your original creations over here.

The previous advice is pretty much spot on the money

Copyright exists as soon as you make public your idea with the little copyright symbol. It doesn’t offer a whole lot of protection, but it offers some.

This is pretty much the same advice that I have received so far.

BubbleChucks wrote:
Obtaining a patent for your idea will cost a small fortune and entail a very lengthy process. Having obtained a patent it WILL cost you even more to defend it. And it’s debatable whether your chance of success warrants the defense (irrespective of the other party being at fault).

Board games are still a grey area when it comes to protection. The appearance of a game can be protected quite easily. However, the mechanics are very difficult to protect. It’s all nonsense really and the system is hopelessly out of date.

This is exactly the same advice that I have received from three different sources (Four including this one) Apparently it harks back to a legal case 5 years ago (Forgive me if the details are a little fuzzy as this was a phone conversation). Previously to this in the UK board games could be registered as a patent, in a case the judge decided that it was not defendable under the patent law, which is why we now have the different Copyright, registered design etc parts to make up a 'whole' level of protection.

I don't believe I can get a patent as this is not classified as a 'new' invention. Although I am waiting to confirm this prior to the application.

BubbleChucks wrote:
To anyone with a working knowledge of board games the mechanic is what defines a game and the resulting game play. The theme or appearance is, more often than not, secondary in importance. The majority of consumers buy a game for the game play and not as an object or collection of objects to look at. So it would seem to make sense to focus on the element that the buyers of the product are actually buying.

However, assessing the uniqueness of collected game mechanics is a lot more difficult and time consuming than assessing something that can be viewed with the naked eye. I would hazard to guess that the reason for the current system of authentication is purely one of simplicity over actual merit.

The system becomes more bizarre when you look at some of the things that can be protected and the similarity they have to the board game or video game model.

A musical score can be protected, even though it is in essence the same stock notes arranged in an original combination to create a unique sound. The visual representation of this sound is demonstrated in physical form by the notations on a music sheet.

However, anyone with an awareness of music will know that Mozarts musical score sheets do not adequately convey the composers full intentions for the piece and many different variations are possible from the same score – while keeping true to the musical notations.

So the orchestration of notes on a music sheet can be viewed as an objective re-imagining of stock notes, even though it can be interpreted in numerous ways. The music sheet stands as the written source to be protected and the sound is the resulting output when used.

In comparison a rule sheet, comprised of letters arranged to physically communicate orchestrated game play, is denied protection, because it is only accorded the status of an idea.

Why the unique grouping of game mechanics, as portrayed in a set of game rules, is denied the same protection is beyond me. Unfortunately, that’s how it is with game protection.

That being said, protection for a game is possible. It’s one of the reasons why game publishers add their own artwork. This gives them something they can protect in terms of visual appearance and the protection can be gained relatively quickly and cheaply.

This Is the step I am currently at, my prototypes produced with either free or commercial artwork are not fit for retail or protection.

BubbleChucks wrote:
Cheap isn’t a word that is often associated with protection (ask the warrior with the card stock armour), but when you take into account the realistic financial returns for a game then cheap is the realisic way to go. If the game becomes a smash hit then adding further protection at a later date may be an option, and any existing protection will make the process a lot easier.

Like I have said, Breaking even on any investment would be unexpected but great.

BubbleChucks wrote:
So what is available in terms of cheap protection for an idea/product?

First up, cheapest and least protection is a copyright – which is free and only involves the public expression of an idea in written form.

The next one is a Trademark. If you Trademark the name of your game it will stop anyone else from using the same name for another ‘game’ related product. If you are looking to make a series of games or you have the intention of releasing expansions to develop a product range then a Trademark will also help to protect the developing brand. A Trademark will also offer benefits in relation to licensing your game.

The next option is a Registered Design. This protects the appearance of your game and anything that can be seen. This type of protection will cover the visual elements of your game, such as game components, layout and artwork – making it difficult for anyone to directly copy your game.

However, a Registered Design doesn’t protect any internal workings that can’t be seen by simply looking at the product in its given state (which can sometimes apply to internal workings). This is why it can be a good idea to submit product applications where pictures/representations of the product are taken from a source with a transparent outer casing – and subsequent products are produced with the normal retail casing.

Both of these options will grant the game some protection and they can be acquired relatively quickly and for very little expense. When applying for these forms of protection the designer can also opt for National coverage, European coverage or Worldwide coverage – each having a different price point.

Bang on the money, thank you for this, I can see I should have joined alot sooner :)

RAVaught wrote:

Yes, but it is kind of flimsy, really. Which is why I didn't focus on that too much. Even the 'poor man's copyright'(mailing a sealed package to yourself) offers some measure of coverage, but neither offer as much as actually filing it.

I have a few 'PMC' documents at the moment, I have access to a franking machine that can date documents with a dated postmark, I am going to verify this is 'acceptable'

Martin-r-m wrote:

Hi,

in my opinion a simple way to protect a name is to register the name at the internet. www.mygamename.com and www.mygamename.eu can be registered for some $ and you will need them anyway. You now can proof the date of registration and the use of this name for a game.
The low level of copyright is not negative. You, as a small selfpublisher would loose any lawsuit started by the big players in this buisness. Ravensburger, Hasbro and so on would keep 100 lawyers and control all game mechanics and kick you out of the buisness....

I am erring on the side of caution with alot of this, I don't envision this occupying shelf space in a major chain and I'm taking a realistic timescale with approach, costings and production. And this may come to nothing, but we'll see how we go on.

Thanks for all the responses guys, much appreciated.

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