Building a game based news site

Tue, 05/27/2014 - 08:24

#1

RyanRay

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Joined: 03/27/2014

So, are you making a news

So, are you making a news site or a game?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 06:26

#2

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

A game

It's a game and the news are moves.
A different concept.

We see games everywhere, they are now big part of our life.
The reality that we see in the newspapers looks like a game.

So, why showing "the game" with a newspaper or a news site ?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 12:08

#3

laperen

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Joined: 04/30/2013

your title claims you are

your title claims you are making a news site promoting games

your post claims you are making game with a news site theme

and the rest of your content does not make either distinction clear, unless neither of the above is what you are trying to explain

If this is some "revolutionary world concept" however, it has been very poorly explained. I do not know how news can be a move, or how the audience can be a participant in news at all. how does making the news site interactive make news any more engaging?

you will need to explain both the benefits of making news engaging, and how the interactions will work.

example, how big a population plays at one time, the usage of news as a move, winning conditions etc, what the audience gets out of their participation

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 15:33

#4

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

Maybe you are right, it is

Maybe you are right, it is hard to explain it.

What I want to make is :

Replacing the news site with a game.

Like Risk or Diplomacy.
You won't see news about Russia or Syria but moves in a game.

You don't participate in the game.
The players are Putin, Bashar Asad, Obama, CIA, USBC bank etc...

The world reality is the "real game" and it's time to change the way "we see the world" .

Instead having a news site or a newspaper we will see a real game.

That is the way it should be.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 15:08

#5

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

How to make the game ?

The world reality is a "power game" and therefore the game must be about power.

Power has no definition but maybe it is possible to build a game based on position, direction, action and movement instead.

http://www.unc.edu/~fbaum/teaching/articles/Dahl_Power_1957.pdf

http://www.abandonia.com/files/extras/24740_game_extra_1.pdf

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power-up

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balance_of_power_in_international_relations

Maybe a game model can be based on a "place", power and action can be described as "places".

go in to power
go out of power
move to power
remove from power
to seize power

move to action
go out of action
go into action

go in to direction
go out of direction

A "place" can be the basis to other terms :
Position, movement, navigation, orientation, target, map and compass.

action is a place.
action has a direction.
action has a value.
action has a position.
action has an outcome.

The outcome of an action can be a position on a map ( value, amount of power ).

to reach a high position
to change position
central position
move to a new position

A game based on social behavior can be based on :

Power, movement, action.
Mechanics ( leverage, friction, movement ).
Electricity ( current, influence, resistance, capacity, magnetism ).
Navigation and orientation, position, map, compass, values, degrees.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 20:21

#6

laperen

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Joined: 04/30/2013

To make this game you need

To make this game you need deep understanding of at LEAST, politics and governance of several countries, and economics on a global scale.

what is the reason for this game to exist anyway. what benefit is there to the populace or world leaders, for the world leaders to participate in it?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 20:23

#7

RyanRay

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Joined: 03/27/2014

I hate being such a devil's

I hate being such a devil's advocate, but isn't this just an unnecessary step between news happening and then reaching the populace? And wouldn't a game like this end up taking multiple days, weeks, or months to complete?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:38

#8

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

The world leaders already

The world leaders already participate in it.
What they do is "playing the game".

But now you see them "playing" in a news site.
I want to see them "playing" in a real game, like a board game.

This is an original concept, not a normal game and not a news site.

I'm sure this is the future of the media industry!

A combination of social theory, politics and game development.

Now you see player actions as static content, instead, you will see actions in a dynamic game.

In the last years we see the collapse of journalism, this idea might be what they're looking for.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 08:58

#9

RyanRay

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Joined: 03/27/2014

Perhaps post a sample

Perhaps post a sample rulebook? I sincerely have no idea what this "game" would even look like.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 09:58

#10

X3M

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Joined: 10/28/2013

I think I know of a way of

I think I know of a way of creating some basics for such a game.
But the explanations here are very poor and vague until now.

Although if we think of the theme. We can come up with something ourselves. Every one could try this.

I think it could be like the following:
- The player is a world leader (better make that fictional instead of using real names)
- The player controls the news (no, let's call it the media)
- By using the media, the leader can gather population to serve his/her cause.
- There might be something like having morale, technology, and a size for a players army.
- An army might attack a country, attack terrorists, or serve as peacekeepers. Or help another army (patriot missiles as example) It is just a tool like the media. There might not be actual fighting, just a happening.
- For gaining more support, not only does the army have to do something to achieve the goal. The media has to be controlled in such a way that the world population thinks it was a good move by the player.

Each leader needs to have a goal. 2 Examples:
- Like creating an united nations like USA or Europe.
- Or bringing peace between countries.

And I think there are ways for players to work together in some situations. There is a lot of diplomacy between players and with the game.

***
I think...
This game wont work.

But further than that, it is hard to come up with proper mechanics any way. I see this more as a card game than a board game. Unless you do move around on a board for opportunities. I don't think it would be a fun game though. Politics are boring or hard to understand for a lot of people. And there can be a lot of "hate" if you start using groups like different religions, "racism" stuff, cultures etc.

No, this game wont do any good. That is my opinion.
And only some one who is neutral and has a good understanding of politics and media can create such a game.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 15:57

#11

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

Philosophical point of view = logic

For me this game is a way to see the world.

I'm trying to find a theoretical base for behavior.

Power
Action
Movement
Orientation
values
compass
Capacity
Input-output

The game logic is based on a "place".

Examples
---------

- You cannot move "above" the law.

- You need to "go into action" to change your position in the game map.

- Two move into one action and the result is one has a higher position then the second, he is the winner.

- You need to "unite" all available actions into one action and then to give the action a direction.

- The target is "to move" to a power position.

Fri, 05/30/2014 - 16:46

#12

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Compass
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Value_%28personal_and_cultural%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_value_orientations
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_movement

Maybe a game can be based on movement and orientation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_theory_%28sociology%29
And about action.

Sun, 06/01/2014 - 16:30

#13

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

New explenation

There are two computer screens :

----------- -------------------------------
| CNN | | COMPUTER GAME |
----------- -------------------------------

CNN screen
--------------------
Real world news.
The real world reality.
What we see is real.
News-items
Static

COMPUTER GAME screen
---------------------------------------
Game Moves.
Not the world reality.
Everything works together like a system.
What we see is not real.
Dynamic

On CNN you see "world news".
On a game you don't see "game news" but game moves.
The term news doesn't even exist when were talking about games.

Now imagine a third screen that makes a combination of the two screens.

------------------------
| The real game |
------------------------

On the third screen we see the real world reality but not through the news.
We see the real world as a game system ( RISK, DIPLOMACY ), as game "moves".
We stay in the same reality but we see it as we are in a game reality.

Mon, 06/09/2014 - 17:39

#14

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

What do we realy see on the news ?

Now you just see some independent moves like in Syria or in Crimea.
You read about their actions and movements.
You read about "The game" but you don't see a game.

When were talking about economy, war, diplomacy, what are we really talking about ?

War is a collision between forces, movement.
Diplomacy is about changing course of direction, road map.
Economy is about making values, exchange.

So instead of delivering news in terms of stories it is much more interesting to see them as part of a game system based on movement, orientation, action.

You show the "news" in a game system based on movement, orientation, action.

News structure
-----------------------
Normally news sites concentrate on the content of a news item.
they show us pictures and dates of events and tell us about details of what happened.

The idea is to extract the news structure out of these events.

We see on the news the words :
union, alinement, direction, target, inter, position, value.
This words are the structure of the events we see around us.

Based on these words I want to build a game system.

So the news story is actually not the center any more, instead, it is about the formal, logic structure of the news / reality.

I'm sorry it takes me so much time to explain everything, It is complicated and abstract idea.

Mon, 06/09/2014 - 22:55

#15

laperen

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Joined: 04/30/2013

You seem to have a concept

You seem to have a concept already. Whether it is a good idea no one knows. But it is time to solidify the idea. Apply it to some real life examples. Maybe watch a news channel program and see how you can link the events into the game.

and again i ask, what are YOUR motivations for wanting to make this "game" at all.

Tue, 06/10/2014 - 18:18

#16

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

The reason - Life is a game

-

I already have a basic model based on the news.

Everything you see around you can be deduced from :
"power" and "place".

I think the world can be describes like this :
freedom, movement, map, position, value, direction, place, high, low, center.

--------------

The reason I want to make this game is that I think it is a very good idea and I have already put a lot of work in to it.

First, I wanted to build a news site.

I told my self that it will be just another news site unless I will have it based on some original idea first.

While taking academic courses in human humanities ( open university ) I understood that the best way to describe how the world works is not by using theories from sociology or philosophy but using other kind of knowledge.

Today I believe that the best way to see and understand the world is to look at it as a real game based on "working knowledge" like physics, logic, navigation.

The target of the game is to get more power and to win other players ( money, politics, war ).

high power position
Center position
Top position
To have more money
To be the first

=======================================

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simulation
-----
Simulation is the imitation of the operation of a real-world process or system over time.[1] The act of simulating something first requires that a model be developed; this model represents the key characteristics or behaviors/functions of the selected physical or abstract system or process. The model represents the system itself, whereas the simulation represents the operation of the system over time.

Simulation is also used with scientific modelling of natural systems or human systems to gain insight into their functioning.

-----

The best way to simulate human behavior is by using a game system.

Newspapers and news sites can't do that.

-

Tue, 06/10/2014 - 19:39

#17

laperen

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Joined: 04/30/2013

Your ideas and aims while

Your ideas and aims while admirable, have no tangible effect as of now. If you cannot show how your idea can work in an example scenario, I doubt anyone is going to understand it in its current abstract form. I think this forum post replies thus far speak for themselves.

Its time to make a prototype, put your idea to the test on some scenarios in real life and materialize it. Unless you have no intention of doing so and are merely trying to express an idea, most will say this is a waste of time.

Thu, 06/12/2014 - 07:42

#18

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

The structure of the news.

I'm already working on this for a long time.

Orientation, map, values, direction, north, compass.

Power, action, capacity, movement.

Distance, height, direction, position.

We can see that the news contain some principles that can be suitable as a theoretical basis for a game.

I have a site and a model but it is in Hebrew.
The language is based on the principles above.

It is a combination of logic, language, physics, orientation.

www.mapatmishak.co.il

Thu, 06/12/2014 - 09:18

#19

laperen

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Joined: 04/30/2013

I do not doubt your abilities

I do not doubt your abilities as a thinker, but right now the idea is so poorly explained I doubt anyone can understand what you are trying to achieve let alone how it works on a first read.

The idea is poorly explained because you do not even attempt to relate your ideas to a real world scenario, but instead use abstract and intangible terms which only serve to make the idea more confusing.

You cannot expect your readers to come in knowing what you are thinking of. Why would they bother reading it at all if that was the case? Adding to the fact your readers here probably care more about fun than social experiments from games.

Thu, 06/12/2014 - 10:51

#20

X3M

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Joined: 10/28/2013

Well...

I admire your conviction. But...

Players are not going to watch the news for this.
Nor are they going to play for years. To intensive. They rather have a normal game like ogame,playteq,farma etc.

Besides, every country has its own media. And there is a lot of conflicting information. The difference between western, eastern, russian and arabic media is huge. It is also a bit of a brainwash to most of the people on earth.

If you are even considering this game, keep it based on 1 country per "game room".

A fake stock market is easier to implement. And more fun to do too. And that too can be linked to the real world. (Some banks have this as a game already though)

Thu, 06/12/2014 - 11:47

#21

Ecarots

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Joined: 08/23/2013

sounds like

This sounds to me like a fantasy sports league.
Each player would choose a world leader or team. The actual news events would result in scoring for the player.
Invade a country +x points
lose power base -x points
economic boom + x points and so on.

Fri, 06/13/2014 - 03:32

#22

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

Game mechanic

Maybe this can help:
http://www.bgdf.com/node/14642

Since I'm not a game designer I can't explain in terms of game design what I'm doing.

What I was trying to do is to find the "game mechanic" or "game play" of the real game - reality.

What is a game ?

How human behavior can be described as a game system ?
What are the parts of the system ?
How the system works ?

I think that the answer lies around here :

Orientation
-----------
direction, north, compass,
distance, height, position, map, values.

Power
-----
action, capacity, resistance, influence, movement, position.

I could maybe make a game based on war, shootings, graphics etc... but I think this is a waist of time.

I wanted to go deeper then just visual representation of the world.

This is what makes the idea original and unique.
People are used to see news sites and games as graphics running on the screen.

I want to show them something different.

### EXAMPLE ###

The words "unity" , "one".

usa, uk, ussr, un.

This is a key element in human behavior, to unite themselves using transportation, social networks, unions.

Leadership is "one".
Monopoly is about "one"
Veto in the power of the "one' to stop others from action.

So, we have a grid / map, and we see on it unity, the grid becomes more and more unite as one.

The reason is POWER, unity is more power.
There is one person above the unity, the leader, president, only "one" on top of the group.
You have one manager, one leader.

You can give a united action one direction only, each member of the group fights to change/turn the action to his direction ( will ).
The one who gives the direction has the power of the all group.

------------

Power is about position.
Power is about direction.
Power is about quantity.

Sat, 07/12/2014 - 09:36

#23

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

Logical structure with social meaning

I think I have a better explanation.

The idea is to design a logical structure which have a special meaning.
The meaning is related to human behavior.

The news can be a "play" in that structure by some rules.
The game will look like a board game / logic game.

Movement, direction, values, target, position.
These terms are based on logic / mapping and can describe behavior as well.

A map is a way to describe the world based on relationships between places.
The social world can be described by a logical map.

News can be shown as movement on the map or changes in the map structure.

Sat, 07/12/2014 - 10:23

#24

laperen

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Joined: 04/30/2013

No amount of explanation is

No amount of explanation is going to move this thing forward. Test it already.

Since your idea is meant to be an addition to the world's current existing events, get a newspaper, or some choice sources of news, and show how your idea would work in it.

Sat, 07/12/2014 - 11:08

#25

DifferentName

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Joined: 09/08/2013

For a moment

For a moment I thought this post was someone making a game based on a news site. Like you have to get leads and publish articles before your opponents! I need some caffeine.

*Update after waking up a little and actually reading*
Well that's more confusing than I expected. If I'm understanding correctly, the "game" is real life, and the website is showing our progress in the "game"? So the only way to "play the game", is to become a world leader in real life? And when a country goes to war in real life and thousands of people die, you show this on your website by moving a couple pieces on a board on your website? If I'm understanding correctly, that seems a bit insensitive.

If I'm not understanding correctly, I guess I'm in the same boat as everyone else. Explaining the idea in a clear simple way would help, instead of talking in broad general concepts.

Sat, 07/12/2014 - 11:27

#26

RyanRay

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Joined: 03/27/2014

laperen wrote:No amount of

laperen wrote:

No amount of explanation is going to move this thing forward. Test it already.

This.

Mon, 07/14/2014 - 17:54

#27

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

The media already uses GAME

The media already uses GAME with real events even wars :
And they do it a lot these days.

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2013/11/dubious-wisdom-assad-wa...

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e17ea6ce-011b-11e4-a938-00144feab7de.html#axzz...

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/apr/17/british-jihadists-p...

http://www.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2014/04/15/playing-putins-game/

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2013/04/are-chemical-weap...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/10900093/Ukrain...

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/views/news/middle-east/2014/06/04/The-me...

http://www.npr.org/2014/04/23/305961255/putins-chess-moves-in-ukraine-br...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2571504/Putins-playing-chess-pla...

We live in a serious game.
People die BECAUSE of the game, because some politicians or PLAYERS want to WIN the GAME.

That is the real social behavior in this world.
.
.
.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serious_game

.
.
.
.
.

REAL WORLD --> LOGICAL STRUCTURE --> SOCIAL MEANING

The news is a play in the logical structure.

.
.
.
.

Rules of play book :

The 3 schema :
Rules, play, culture

Rules is the formal, logical structure
Play is the news
Culture is the social meaning

The news must be part of a dynamic system and not static like today.

This is THE BIG problem with this idea.

The solution is to describe the world as a logical structure and the news will be the play in this structure.

The structure must be with social meaning.

Mon, 09/29/2014 - 16:34

#28

4z7fbc

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Joined: 05/24/2014

* Placing news inside a game *

Placing the news in a game context.

http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscience/2009/11/18/breaking-the-inverte...

The way to translate real time events to game elements is to build a suitable context.

The context is a system or a model which gives meaning to the news.
The model structure is based on a map.
The model operates by the logic of a game.

- Simulating the real world as a game -

Movement
Alignment
Connection
Direction
Position

ISIS is more extreme then al qaeda which mean they position themselves after or in front of al qaeda.

In order to be the first you have to move to the center position or move to the extreme position ( The logic behind ISIS extreme actions ).

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/al-qaeda-khorasan-syria-bigger-threat-to-us-...

Khorasan group is now considered even more extreme then ISIS.

So now Khorasan places themselves in front of ISIS.
The result is that they get on the news.

United states wants Iran to be in full ALIGNMENT with international law.
Same line of action as the US wants.

Coalition forces GO INTO ACTION to REMOVE ISIS FROM POWER.

ISIS advanced to power by taking more oil fields.

Iran advanced to power by having more nuclear facilities.

The players want to advance to power but each one must stop the others.

UNITY
-----
ISIS+Al-Nusra Front? Islamists reportedly join forces, new threat against West issued

http://rt.com/news/191396-nusra-qaeda-air-strikes-islamic

Putin’s long game? Meet the Eurasian Union

http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/03/09/putin-long-game-meet-eurasia...

http://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2014/feb/18/brief-primer-vlad...

SUPREMACY
----------
ISIS, al-Qaeda compete for supremacy in global jihad

http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/iw/originals/2014/02/isis-qaeda-zawahri-...

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Supremacy_%28board_game%29&old...

Thu, 10/09/2014 - 14:52

#29

4z7fbc

Offline

Joined: 05/24/2014

More explanation

The current model ( gamethenews )
---------------------------------------------------
- Based on traditional journalism - focusing on the content - instead an article you see a game.
- Games are based on current events and therefore loose interest fast.
- Game based on just a single event.
- Action and results are not real - chosen by people.
- Mapping of a single event into a game.

The new model
----------------------
- Every news-item is a part in the big puzzle or a single system event.
- Every event is a movement in a game.
- Based on a big story which connects all the events together.
- The actions and results that you see are real.
- The context is important, not the content.
- Mapping of all reality into one game.

Thu, 10/09/2014 - 16:41

#30

mulletsquirrel

Offline

Joined: 08/14/2014

Is your "game" really just a

Is your "game" really just a way to view news data?

What I get from this is a way to query the news about different world happenings, such as any news article pertaining to a war, and maybe view the data on a map or something. You said people can't play the game, but the players are world leaders.

Maybe I am way off from your idea, but I haven't seen anything closely resembling a game yet...

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