Skip to Content
 

Computer assisted board games

12 replies [Last post]
larienna
larienna's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2008

In the yugioh manga, there are some board game with computers behind that hold information or do some computations. Do you think that today, or in a near future, we could expect to make computer assisted board games? The computer is there only for the info and the complex calculation, there is no rule game validation.

For example, in a D&D game, you could have a small device that remembers your HP and which spell you have cast. In monopoly, you could record your money and what property you have. Another example, for a CCG that I first wanted to make as a video game, you would have been able to record the HP, MP, and rage points of your character plus the HP of one monster. And when you click new turn, you would recover automaticaly some MP.

Do you think that it will take too much time to synchronise the information between the game and the computer since it must be done by the user?

Do you think that it will end up anyway in a video game since board game element will be underused?

Do you think people will be interested in buying a game where you must buy in extra an electronic device, even if this device is reusable for many game?

Do you think that computer assited game is just a lazy way to make a game without making proper simplification to make sure it runs as a complete board game?

Here is what I tough what the device could be if it was done today. It would look moke like a pocket PC or an electronic wizard. There would be a small LCD screen, text mode only ( probably cheaper than graphic mode) with around 40x5 characters. About a dozen of buttons to nativate through the information. Around 1 Meg of flash rom to hold the applets, and 256K to 512K of memory. With maybe a save chip inside the device like the PS to save your game. You will transfer the applets with a USB cable, and when you boot the device, there would be a browser to select which game you want to play/assist.

theraje
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

I think that a couple years ago, they made a Pokedex gadget a lot like what you're thinking of. I think it was a sort of encyclopedia on Pokemon, which may've helped with the video games or card games (though I've never seen it in person, so I could be wrong).

You can buy simple LCD games for about $5 US now, so I would think that it's only a matter of time before this happens. It sure beats writing everything down on paper. :P

I'm pretty sure you can download stuff for PDA's that serve as D&D "helpers" and such. If you're inclined, you could possibly write a simple program that works on Palm OS and/or PocketPC operating systems and make it downloadable for players.

larienna
larienna's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2008
Computer assisted board games

An idea that passed into my mind make the interface easier is by using barcode on cards. ( I remember that there was an electronic game that worked like this.

For example, let say you are playing a yugioh style game where the monster stats are far more complex with non deterministic outcome. The electronic device could manage the battle. When there is a battle between 2 monsters, each player slide they monster card into the barcode reader of their device and it calculate who wins.

OR in my example from the previous post, If I cast a fire ball spell, I slide my card into the device, it automatically decrease my mana according to the casting cost and it reduce the opponent's life points.

DSfan
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

Quote:
Do you think that today, or in a near future, we could expect to make computer assisted board games?

In my opinion, any game that has something electronic is considered more of video game, or electronic toy then a board game. To me, a board game uses no form of electronics. Just a simple board and pieces.

Now I'm not saying it will never happen. Of course it will. Someone will always try to make the merge between electronics and boardgames, that would them out. Like you said, complex computations would certainly be helpful. Although any game too complex I would never play.

Quote:
An idea that passed into my mind make the interface easier is by using barcode on cards. I remember that there was an electronic game that worked like this.

If you are thinking of the same thing as me, then I remember it too! It was a game were you have a little palm pilot shaped device that you take places and scan barcodes. This would in turn give you monsters that you could battle others with.

I dont think it did very well though.

Justin

hpox
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

I'm not too fond of electronics == multimedia for boardgames. Although we all enjoyed Atmosphear/Nightmare.

I think some smart eurogame designers will start using electronics in the near future (5 years) to streamline their games, to remove fiddliness. Without basing the entire game around the electronics.

In some heavier games, to help the player remember how to play, how to setup, and to follow the "phases" in the right order.

A big thing coming is the electronic ink technology. Paper will act as a screen, but once the electrons are in place and form the image, it doesn't required electricity anymore. It will be amazing for everyone but certainly for the boardgame industry and us designers. Another Age of Steam expansions? Sure let me hook up the board to my computer via usb. And Joe released his third homemade map today, Age of Steam on Mars!

hpox
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

DSfan wrote:
...a little palm pilot shaped device that you take places and scan barcodes. This would in turn give you monsters that you could battle others with.

I dont think it did very well though.

It sucked shit. Seriously. If it's the same one I got when I was about 10 years old, it blew. Scanning almost never worked. There was no gameplay at all. It really was just scanning barcodes, giving you "stats" and the battle was entirely automatic. And besides, the teenage mutant ninja turtles noodles got beat by a box of frosted flakes. This is wrong.

theraje
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

hpox wrote:
There was no gameplay at all. It really was just scanning barcodes, giving you "stats" and the battle was entirely automatic.

Yeah, that was one of my concerns when I read Larienna's reply to my post. It sounds more like the computer is playing the game, and not you. It sort of takes away from the physical aspects of the game. Sure, you have cards or whatnot with barcodes... but what are you actually doing? A game that worked too much like that might be mildly entertaining for a limited amount of time, but would soon be relegated to the closet, never to be touched for entertainment reasons again.

dete
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

hpox wrote:
DSfan wrote:
...a little palm pilot shaped device that you take places and scan barcodes. This would in turn give you monsters that you could battle others with.

I dont think it did very well though.

It sucked shit. Seriously. If it's the same one I got when I was about 10 years old, it blew. Scanning almost never worked. There was no gameplay at all. It really was just scanning barcodes, giving you "stats" and the battle was entirely automatic. And besides, the teenage mutant ninja turtles noodles got beat by a box of frosted flakes. This is wrong.

LOL!!!

originally you were suppose to scan collectible cards.
Yes I have seen the rise to CCG, and this was part of it.

Rise of CCG in Japan:

1) huge popularity of a collectible sticker called Bikuriman
1 sticker in 1 chocolate bar which was about 30 cents.
note these guys were way ahead of their time, the stickers
were made to actually play a sort of tag like game with them
which nobody did, we just collected them.
2) huge popularity in SD Gundam figures you get from
those machines, put in a coin and crank the handle
and out comes a capsule with a toy in it, about $1 for 3 at the time.
3) Same SD Gundam guys now made into cards. Cards became
popular because of the rise of telephone cards.
4) These cards were sold from machines, and started recieving
HP and attack points on them. Still not much of game at all.
5) Enter Pokemon.

ANd you know when MTG came in the picture, now there was a SOLID
game play mechanics behind it. sorry I went off topic Larienna.

Kreitler
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

theraje wrote:
I'm pretty sure you can download stuff for PDA's that serve as D&D "helpers" and such. If you're inclined, you could possibly write a simple program that works on Palm OS and/or PocketPC operating systems and make it downloadable for players.

I wonder if it might be practical to put this kind of software on mobile phones. PDAs are still relatively rare, but software-enabled mobile phones are becoming more and more popular.

Imagine a collectible board game that played standalone, but had an extra element for people who wanted to download the software into their phone? Maybe you got spell expansions for your characters, or new fighting moves.

As for having straight "helper" apps, how many games need that, and of the ones that do, how practical is it to enter the relevant data into the machine (I'm thinking of things like Age of Renaissance and its market system)? Using the cell-phone example, maybe you can download the "virtual market" software and then conduct all market transactions via the phone, thus eliminating all of the fiddly chits...

theraje
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

You know, that's an idea. It's pretty easy to write software that runs on many mobile phones (thanks to things like J2ME). Good catch!

larienna
larienna's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2008
Computer assisted board games

I think the problem with cell phones is just a matter of space. You must make small application.

Still since there are some basic video games for cell phone, making board game helper should be done easily.

One of my friend is working as a cell phone game play tester. If you have important questions you can always ask him.

Infernal
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

I reckon this could be an idea that is about to come of age. The games like this made several years ago did not have the popularity of mobile computing (and mobile phones are a form of mobile computer). This type of game could become popular today.

With the camera phones one could photograph a "card" and a series symbols (or bar codes) could place the stat of the card into the phone. From here you could "play" the card (send it to the reciever) to make your move.

Off the top of my head as a game design (if some one wants to actually make it feel free just credit me :D):
1) The players are Mages.
2) Spell cards can be bought (or come in a cerial box, etc).
3) To play a card one needs to "scan" it into the phone (enter a unique ID, photgraph it, barcode/magnetic strip or use an RFID tag).
4) The player then sends this "spell" via sms or such to a server, along with the spells target ID (who is to recieve the spell (this is to keep the player's phone numbers anonomus and keep track of the rules).
5) The server matches the card ID and performs the required calculations (remove HP, etc) and informs the target and sender of the result.
6) Casting a spell cost mana, which recharges over time. Each spell has its casting cost on the card.

If you do want to make it into a game I would be willing to work as the game designer (just PM me)

Other ideas:
This game could use the location of people to determine what targets are valid (this is done with other mobile phone games now).

Cards could have a casting life (ie the card ID can only be used a set number of times), or caould have a cool off period before the ID could be used again.

This could be made as a device specificly created to play the game (eg for magic the gathering), and all functionallity built into it (RFID tags can store a lot of data nowdays, like a rule script for each card).

Is this the type of use you were thinking of?

Kreitler
Offline
Joined: 12/31/1969
Computer assisted board games

Infernal wrote:
Is this the type of use you were thinking of?

Not really, though it's an interesting idea.
I was thinking about "game aids" that help people play traditional board games. Here's an example:

For months, I've been struggling with a design for a game called "Empire", which is a tabletop remake of a classic Apple II game. It's your standard "build ships and conquer the galaxy" style game, but the computer version involved hidden movement of all fleets and hidden locations for all planets (until discovered).

I haven't been able to come up with satisfactory mechanics for either of these game systems.

A cell-phone "helper application" would solve both problems. Each player could enter his orders into the software ('send x ships from planet y to planet z), and each turn the starting player could hit the "advance" button. The software would calculate the positions of all fleets and tell players which fleets arrived where that turn. The software could also tell players how to construct the map when their fleets arrived in uncharted territorry (think of it like building the "Settlers" board whenever you sailed a ship to a previously undiscovered location).

After all fleets arrived and all planets had been positioned, players would resolve combat, trade, and tech development for the current turn. Afterward, they would all enter their new orders into the software in preparation for the next turn.

The only drawback I can see is that you'd have to have a cell-phone to play the game. Either that, or I'd still have to come up with some abstract representation of the hidden map and fleet mechanics, in which case, why bother with the cell-phone helper?

K.

Syndicate content


forum | by Dr. Radut