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Theme brainstorming

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 08:03
hotsoup
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I'd like some help coming up with a strong theme. The mechanics of the game revolve around influencing your opponent's choices. When it is your turn, you are limited to several specific actions. The twist is that those actions have all been chosen by your opponents, so when you choose one, thinking it will further your goal, you are also helping another player, though it may not be immediately apparent how.

So this obviously lends itself to an intrigue/backstabbing/political type game, where the focus is not on directly effecting your opponent, but weaving plans within plans and getting your opponents to dance to your turn without them knowing it. Originally this was going to be themed around the Gormenghast books (which I love, and are very evocative) but frankly most people don't know them. Another great idea I had was that the players are all high ranking demons subtly vying for the throne of Hell, but I think this is a bit too dark. What are your thoughts? I really want something that will draw the players into the texture and mood of whatever setting I end up on.

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 08:19
#1
AsgerSG
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Twist of Fate / Twisted Fate

Twist of Fate / Twisted Fate / Fateful Twist

I'm a Gormenghast Fan, but can see how it could be too niche for a game :)

Why not set it in an Illuminati setting? My very mediocre knowledge of that "theme" has both politics, different factions vying for power, as well as twists and turns of fate. Just a shot in the dark though :)

Asger

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 09:37
#2
hotsoup
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Illuminati is one option, for

Illuminati is one option, for sure, but it has been done before by Steve Jackson, famously. I considered the players all being norse gods, toying with the fates of men to get back at each other, but there are so many mythology based games...

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 09:54
#3
AsgerSG
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I'm aware that the theme has

I'm aware that the theme has been used before, but if your game mechanics play substantially different, then I don't see the problem :)

You are unlikely to find a theme that hasn't been used at all some where, so in my humble opinion the clincher is if you put some of it in a new context, not that you have to reinvent it all from scratch!

Asger

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 10:02
#4
Orangebeard
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Political Puppets?

Perhaps something around the idea of puppet candidates trying to win an election while their opponents undercut their public support base?

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 10:05
#5
Cogentesque
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Heya hotsoup! I don't think I

Heya hotsoup!

I don't think I have seen you on the boards before? I may be wrong, but if I am right: Welcome to BGDF! You seem like the right kind of person to hang out here :)

Asger, was it you that was doing the ghormanghast game from before? But it was going to be too slow because you said that massive parts of the gormenghast books take place over just a few days, so would find it hard to implement without being boring or draining ? Right?

Hotsoup back to the question at hand, well lucky for you I made THIS thread http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/690205/what-are-some-unexplored-game-themes on bgg a long time ago. It basically asks what some unexplored themes are and some of them are great!

Alternatively this one: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/694242/what-awesome-theme-should-i-build... once I had a few themes for my AtomPunk (http://cogentesque.wordpress.com/) game I used this to get the consensus of what was hip and trendy in the current environment (read: steam punk, cavemen, war correspondant mostly "novel ideas") and would suggest perhaps doing something similar.

As far as your mechanics go, how do I win the game? The game "win" normally defines the game "play" , if it is to do with health points or some such, then we would need to make it a sentient entity, if it is to od with cards, we could change it to be power stores for some fantasy setting etc. That would be good to know.

Your idea for demons (daemons?) is a nice one and fits quite well. A thought that has just popped into my head (read: novel idea) is that each player is a historical legend, perhaps of somewhere make believe, perhaps "dead in heaven" or whateber, (You read Russ the Legend by david Gemmel? like that) and these "legends" are fighting over who is remembered as the greatest hero of al time. Don't go towards historical figures like napoleon / mousolini - thats probably been done, stick to "Warriors!" or "Horsemen!" or proper hero legends.

Anyway, players take the roll of these legends and are in some kind of forum (arena? Historical text books? afterlife? peoples minds? an actual war?) and they are trying to write history to make them the greatest heros.

"History is written by the victors" Winston Churchill, unknown origin.

This would also give you a nice way to add some kind of theme attribution to "followers" or vocalists of your cause, off on little missions to clear your name as a braggart and spread the true word of your heroism! Also there could even be some kind of thematic bit stuck on to any mechanics that deal with combat - one hero vs the next? Quests to complete? That would be cool. Again, can't really add loads more without knowing a few general rules, win conditions etc.

Another one would be similar to the rpg Paranoia - I always wanted to write a book or something on this topic.
You work for a company. This company does some ambiguous function "health traders" or "good will spreaders" or "monetary estaimtes" or "stock creation" something that NO ONE knows. But the higher you get up in "the tower" then the more you know, the more you uncover, the 'deeper the rabbit hole goes' so to speak. This would be very mysterious and havea lot of striking artwork, and also literally a tower that you have to be of acertain level to progress to a better position, a higher paid role, or literally up the tower (to floor 2) - kind of like a dystopian futuristic coroporate environment where the company is so big that people get lost in its complexity - Players could be trying to vye for poisiton in the company to get to the top. Bons theme element: the higher up they are, the more they have to uncover / moral choices / harder it gets as they uncover more and more. This rought idea could easily based around the illuminati as Asger suggests or some kind of secret security company
or to do with extraterestrial life, even magic or the cthulu mythos -
as the veil extends to all floors except the top.

just a few ideas I can do without knowing more,

hope we've helped buddy!

Cog

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 13:11
#6
NewbieDesigner
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Some words & phrases to play

Some words & phrases to play with:

-Obey Your Master/Pulling Your Strings (from Metallica song)
-Hidden Agenda
-Ulterior Motive
-Conceal/concealed
-Deceipt
-Devious
-Duplicitous
-Unscrupulous

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 15:51
#7
drktron
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How about: Programmed

How about:
Programmed androids
Mind controlling parasites
Puppets :)
Conscience (j. cricket style)
Instinct

Just a few ideas.

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 16:31
#8
bonsaigames
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Themes

Politics
Finance
Secret Organizations
Diplomatic Unions (the UN, NATO, etc)
Office Politics
Clergymen
Sci Fi (who's the alien / android / cthonic monster?)
Time Lords bending the timestream (ok that's Chrononauts)
Corporations
Feudal Lords

When its all said and done theme does matter because some themes just sell better than others, but nothing matters more than having a tight game system that allows the players to have fun while figuring out ways to betray / stymie / cajole without getting caught.

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Tue, 10/18/2011 - 23:16
#9
hotsoup
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Wow thanks for all the input

Wow thanks for all the input guys! A cthulhu game would be pretty neat, where people could play azathoth, dagon, cthulhu, etc. There seems to be a lot of lovecraft saturation right now though. I'm leaning towards the theme being about people or factions trying to take over the throne of some kingdom. This would work great in a Dune theme, but obviously I can't explicitly use that. But a quasi medieval scifi theme would be cool.

Other options: multiple gods creating the universe, and they are all trying to alter the balance of energies and influences in the universe to make it end up the way they want.

Ideally I'm looking for a theme that is grand and exciting in scale, and tending away from euro themes.

When I make a game, I have to first determine the kind of experience I want the players to have, and then begin building mechanics to fit that. I very much dislike games that go the opposite way.

Right now I only have some bare bones mechanics that I like. It will mostly work with cards, I think. Players will draft cards from a central deck each round (like 7 ages). Then, they will cooperatively build each player's action pile. Each player closes his eyes while the other players make a stack of cards from their hands that determine what he is allowed to do that turn. So essentially most of the things you want done in a game have to be done by your opponents. I may have a way for players to incentivize opponents to use the cards they have given them, though in most cases players will not know which players have given them which cards. They can freely lie, bribe, and ally with each other to achieve goals.

I'm also envisioning a board where the effects of the actions are played out, and opportunities for strategies arise. What this will be depends on the theme I settle on, as will the objectives of the game.

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Wed, 10/19/2011 - 05:25
#10
Cogentesque
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But...what about hte legends

But...what about hte legends theme Soup? :(

I thought that was ... really ... good ?

*tear wells up*

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Wed, 10/19/2011 - 06:39
#11
Mikee
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Mind roulette Brain

Mind roulette
Brain roulette
Something involving money (stocks)

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Wed, 10/19/2011 - 15:07
#12
hotsoup
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lol I liked that idea

lol I liked that idea cogentesqe, and I might end up with something similar.

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Thu, 10/20/2011 - 03:59
#13
Cogentesque
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XD

XD

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Fri, 10/21/2011 - 16:56
#14
hotsoup
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I've settled on something

I've settled on something pretty different, and I'm making a prototype now for initial testing. The game takes place in a giant, archaic, interdimensional library. Each of the players plays a junior librarian vying for favor points from the head librarian, so as to be the pick for his successor. Throughout the game, interdimensional vehicles will arrive at the library, seeking certain varieties and quantities of knowledge for their civilization. The librarians can somewhat anticipate which ships are coming where, and try and collect books that provide the knowledge that that ship requires (symbol matching). If a player gets the right combination of books to a ship first, they get the favor points associated with it.

Players can interfere with each other through their accumulated favor points. A blind bidding system allows players to try and pull rank or intimidate other players into doing what they want, if they have more favor. Players can only carry a limited number of books, so they have to anticipate the kinds of knowledge needed in the future, and can trade or steal books from each other in a pinch.

I'll let you guys know how the playtests go once I finish the prototype!

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Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:35
#15
MondaysHero
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How about the Inquisition,

How about the Inquisition, and intrique in the medieval church. It will give a feel of bending people to your will, but under the guise of "working together toward a common good."

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Tue, 10/25/2011 - 21:23
#16
hotsoup
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I've always wanted to do a

I've always wanted to do a game about the Inquisition! Maybe my next project.

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Tue, 10/25/2011 - 23:14
#17
NativeTexan
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Monty Python

MondaysHero wrote:
How about the Inquisition, and intrique in the medieval church. It will give a feel of bending people to your will, but under the guise of "working together toward a common good."

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!!

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Tue, 10/25/2011 - 23:15
#18
NativeTexan
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Very clever.

hotsoup wrote:
I've settled on something pretty different, and I'm making a prototype now for initial testing. The game takes place in a giant, archaic, interdimensional library. Each of the players plays a junior librarian vying for favor points from the head librarian, so as to be the pick for his successor. Throughout the game, interdimensional vehicles will arrive at the library, seeking certain varieties and quantities of knowledge for their civilization. The librarians can somewhat anticipate which ships are coming where, and try and collect books that provide the knowledge that that ship requires (symbol matching). If a player gets the right combination of books to a ship first, they get the favor points associated with it.

Players can interfere with each other through their accumulated favor points. A blind bidding system allows players to try and pull rank or intimidate other players into doing what they want, if they have more favor. Players can only carry a limited number of books, so they have to anticipate the kinds of knowledge needed in the future, and can trade or steal books from each other in a pinch.

I'll let you guys know how the playtests go once I finish the prototype!

I LOVE IT!!! Very clever concept. Can't wait to hear how it turns out!

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Thu, 10/27/2011 - 19:35
#19
hotsoup
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I made a rough prototype and

I made a rough prototype and tested it with my fiance, and got some promising results. The game runs smoothly, and it looks like there are a number of paths to victory. Originally we were playing with two book orders coming in at a time, but found that this discouraged interaction, since we wouldn't compete for the order that the other player was clearly working towards. So with a 2 player game, only 1 order will come in at a time.

I also came up with a way to randomize the incoming orders. Roll 5 d6s. Disregard any 5s or 6s rolled. Each other number represents a knowledge type, so take a card from the appropriate knowledge deck for each die of its type rolled and put them together to form upcoming orders.

During the game an idea came to mind that I like a lot. When book orders come in, players already have to get books that match the knowledge symbols required. So originally I had 4 knowledge decks in different parts of the library that you could draw from.

A way to modify this and build the theme would be to have all of the cards be double sided. Each knowledge deck would be split in half at the beginning of the game and place side by side, like a book open in the middle. Players could flip through the book in either direction, looking for the symbols they wanted. Additionally, when they decide to flip pages, they have to declare the number of pages that they want to flip before they do it, and then flip all of those, even if something they want goes past. So they can see the ordered structure of each randomized book. Eventually they can become familiar with it and get better to flipping to the places that they want.

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Sun, 02/12/2012 - 21:03
#20
Word Nerd
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Just a thought

"Capricious Cabal"

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