Skip to Content
 

When to leave well-enough alone?

6 replies [Last post]
Javenknight
Javenknight's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/27/2016

In the iterative process of game design, how do you know when to change something or to leave it alone? I've been working on a card game, which involves a dice mechanic. But since there was already a lot of randomness in the game, I have been trying to make it work without dice. Now the game is out of balance and I feel like I've created more problems. However, I feel strongly that games need to be streamlined and clunkiness is just unacceptable.

So, should I just constrain myself and accept the imperfections or keep tweaking the design? This of course leads to more tweaking, and more tweaking, and...you get the point.

#feeling loopy

Rimmsolin
Rimmsolin's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/13/2013
First, how a designer

First, how a designer iterates is important.

A "bad" way is to start with a dice game, then play a deckbuilder and now turn your game into a deckbuilder, then hear about a campaign game and turn your game into an RPG dungeon crawler... You get the point.

A "good" way is to start with the mechanic, theme, or even better, an *experience* you want the player to have. If they are to play the role of an age of sail ship captain, then the gameplay should support that. Anything else probably can be cut. So when you're iterating, it should ALWAYS be pushing for that experience and goal, otherwise you will be like a rudderless ship.

Keeping the restrictions in mind too, helps focus your work and know when you're "done". I suggest writing down the number of players, target time, age/demographic, core pillars (principles) your game is trying to accomplish, any restrictions such as box size/components/# cards, price point (about 1/6th of retail price for cost of goods.)

If you know what the end goal is, then you know when to keep iterating. Start by making the big changes (genre, core mechanics) and play with yourself or close friends every 1-2 changes. Then once you've got the core sorted, make small changes and fix problems from the last test, retesting after a few. If you make too many changes between playtests, you'll lose sight WHY something needed to change, or WHAT affect it had on the gameplay when you did.

A few things to keep in mind:
-not everything needs to be in one game
-you can always go make that other deckbuilder/RPG another time
-make big changes up front. Double or half values (not 5%). If that direction feels right, double or half again. Then if it's between, split the differnce. It's like range finding instead of targeting every increment along the way.
-make a fix list and question your testers each playtest to confirm changes were correct
-UNDO changes that were not correct. That's right. CTRL+Z!
-Design more than one game at a time. Switching your brain to nuetral on a problem is sometimes the best way to solve it (days/weeks later sometimes.)

Lastly, you'll know you're close to being done when:
A) Your target audience finishes a game, and wants to play again right away
B) You need to retire the design and try something else. (You can always pick it up.

Good luck!

Experimental Designs
Experimental Designs's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/20/2013
There is a saying many do not

There is a saying many do not abide by in this litigious world we sunk ourselves into and that is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Why would you change something that worked well the first time? I say let a stable design be your foundation and do not deviate from it if possible lest you make it lopsided and it topples over like so many jenga bricks.

McTeddy
Offline
Joined: 11/19/2012
Fine, I'll be the odd man

Fine, I'll be the odd man out.

You said it yourself "games need to be streamlined and clunkiness is just unacceptable." You wouldn't be saying that if your game felt right.

If the imperfections are a real problem, DO NOT ACCEPT THEM. You need a strong foundation to start with and pretending there isn't a problem is a bad idea.

But, first off, make sure that you playtested that original core. Make sure that real players feel that it's too random and clunky.

If the majority enjoy it as is, it isn't broken. It's your designer-ego speaking. Be a pro and tell your ego to shut up.

But if players agree with you, you've got a problem that needs fixing. Leaving it unfixed would be worse than designer-ego.

- - -

Where I will agree with the others is the new direction doesn't seem to be working. You sound like you're further from your goal and that it's eating away at you.

Go back to where you last feel that you were on the right track and restart the fix.

If you feel there is too much randomness, try finding a way to roll half as often, or reduce the impact of a single dice roll.

Try to find a way to let the player to modify a roll to get the results they wanted.

Maybe apply a push-your-luck aspect that lets you boost your chances by reducing the effect of your roll.

Go back and try all sorts of different paths to solve the issue. You know that the one your on now isn't right so head back and look for one that works.

let-off studios
let-off studios's picture
Offline
Joined: 02/07/2011
Core Engagement

Along with what McTeddy and others have said, I have found it useful to consider the game design's "Core Engagement." This is the main thrust of the game itself, around which everything should revolve and orbit.

Think of it as the game's nucleus, where additional parts of the game are there to support this main idea. You may end up modifying the core engagement as time goes on, but the mechanics involved with the game change when the nucleus does - not the other way round.

A useful article describing this invaluable concept is here:
https://kevingnunn.com/2014/01/14/009-finding-and-serving-your-core-enga...

I've found that focusing on the core engagement has naturally streamlined my game design efforts. It may be helpful to you to reflect on this for your own current challenges. Good luck to you! :)

Javenknight
Javenknight's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/27/2016
Cheers!

Thank you all for the feedback. Really valuable suggestions that have helped me see things from a different perspective.

Game on!

larienna
larienna's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2008
It depends how far you are in

It depends how far you are in your design, if you are early, it's normal to dump everything and start something new in a complete different direction. If you are late in the design process, then only small changes would be required.

If dice are that much essential to the game design, then it's only the clunkiness that matters. See other ways to use those same dice but in a more elegant or efficient way. Here are some example:

- Roll all your dice at the beginning of the turn and use them on demand.

- Roll at the begining certain dice, and that is the values that will be used for the whole round.

- Put dice value on cards, when you need to make a roll, you flip the top card from your deck and look at the value.

You see, there are various ways to make it less clunky without necessarily removing the mechanics.

Syndicate content


forum | by Dr. Radut