I'm new to posting here though I have been around for a while.
I need some help. I'm redesigning a game. I've a good handle on game play but am having a hard time identifying suitable end game mechanics. My request of you is this:
give me some end game conditions or mechanics and the games they come from.
I need some ideas to start a mindfire.
You can reply here or at my blog Go Forth And Game - tomgurg.wordpress.com.
Or at tomgurg AT G mail DoT COm.
Thanks in advance for the sparks.
tomg
End Game Conditions
Sun, 03/27/2011 - 16:35
Sun, 03/27/2011 - 16:54
#1
end game condition
Tom,
This is an interesting topic and I could write a whole dissertation on end game conditions in board games. A lot of your decision is going to want to match a few critical factors in my humble opinion:
1. Theme - I am a big believer on theme enhancing game play, tension and enjoyment overall. The end game mechanic should match the overall theme of the game play. If your game is a dungeon crawl and your end game condition is that the game ends after x turns, its going to be anti-climatic.
2. Time - Your end game condition should jive with your intended time of play. This is multi-layered because your time of play needs to jive with the tension of the game. The game has to be long enough to build (and exhaust) tension (between players, or players and game for coop). How long that should be is going to be determined by your mechanics and game play.
3. Tension - Your end game should be determined by the amount of build-up and tension that your game elicits. Every game has a critical point (a climax) where the enjoyment of the mechanics and game play is at its peak. Target that point and allow the resolution of the game to follow shortly afterward.
4. Mechanics - Your end game condition can be (and should be) an integral mechanic to the game overall. Players should be wary of it, whether it is a surprise or planned ending. Whether it is game driven (ends after a certain # of rounds) or player driven (Victory Points, etc).
My suggestion would be to determine a mechanic that fits with your game's theme and game play. Then tweak the details of it to fit with the tension and time of play that you want your game to have.
Sun, 03/27/2011 - 19:28
#2
Hello!
At first I was going to say something like, "Please provide a bit more information about your game so we can try to come up with possible good end-games for it." However, I started thinking of general end-game scenarios and I kinda liked coming up with 'em so I'll list them here:
1.) Player with the most of something wins. <--Most points, most money, most territory, etc.
2.) Player that kills everyone else wins. (Last player standing)
3.) First player to accomplish something wins (first to complete a certain number of quests, first one past some type of finish line, etc.)
Hmmm...how interesting! I guess I was too general because I'm having trouble coming up with any others. It seems that the winning conditions for a lot of games comes down to these three basic categories. I'm sure other posters will show me the errors of my ways.
So...I guess it boils down to the question of HOW do players get the most of something...HOW do the players end up being the last one standing, or HOW do they become the first to accomplish a goal? Those are the mechanics you're speaking of, so now I have to ask, "Please provide a bit more information about your game so we can try to come up with possible good end-games for it." :)
-CB-
-Edit-
Earlier this morning I must've been writing my response at the same time onihero posted HIS most excellent response. That was great, dude. I kicking myself now. You gave some pretty good advice without needing specifics of the OP's game.
Kudos! :)
Sun, 03/27/2011 - 21:27
#3
Here is some options fore
Here is some options fore you, and depending onm teh game they will sute well or not. =)
1. Fixed number of turns.
2. And fixed amount of recorses, when they run out the game ends (recorses can be basicly anyting, cards on the players hand, recors cubes the players can buy and so on).
3. Stack a deck of cards that are drawn in the game, in the botom put a "game ends" card. When drawn the game ends.
4. Have the players be able to interact and make the game end by doing somthing (a example of this would be power grid, when some one builds a pre-determind number of houses the game ends, he is not nesisery the winner but the game ends non the less).
5. Have the game end when a certan number of quests/goals are compleated/acived.
Well that is the once I can come up with that is universial game endewrs. If you tell us more about teh game maby we can come up with a better suted end game criteria...
Good luck to you.
Mon, 03/28/2011 - 13:50
#5
I guess I could have answered
I guess I could have answered your interview question (what's the hardest part of designing a game" with this - choosing and implementing a game end condition! I've had a lot of trouble with this in the past, especially with Terra Prime. I tried several different game end triggers before I found one that I liked, and it's still not perfect.
For Eminent Domain the game end condition works, but there's something a little unappealing about triggering game end on a discrete event and then counting up score at that point. Many games work that way, but it would be cooler if a more organic game end could be used. Not always possible though.
Some people prefer race games for that reason - there's a clear winner (first to do X), but there are problems with that type of game end condition as well, usually involving turn order advantage.
Game End conditions are my bane!
Sat, 04/23/2011 - 08:49
#6
CloudBuster wrote:
1.)
1.) Player with the most of something wins. <--Most points, most money, most territory, etc.
2.) Player that kills everyone else wins. (Last player standing)
I believe CheapAss games had or has at least one game in which players are trying to acquire the most of something (#1 above), but the game ends (and all money/points/whatever are tallied) when the first player to be knocked out of the game *is* knocked out -- which is kind of counter to the mindset behind #2 above. Theirs is a good point, though: the point of playing a game with a group is to have fun with the group, and it's no fun for the player or players who get knocked out of the game to wait around, unable to play, while the "last player standing" gets determined. Once someone loses all their money, or all their territories, or whatever, they get the pain of losing, but then get to jump back into a fresh new game and try again.
It's not appropriate to all kinds of games, but for some kinds I like that approach.
Sat, 04/23/2011 - 17:51
#7
Lots smart people here so I
Lots smart people here so I hesitate to add the doubtful advice that not all games have or require a definite endgame; mostly sim-type or viva pinata organic video games but something to bare in mind maybe?
Tue, 04/26/2011 - 12:47
#8
Unfortunately..
Although that's true for simulations and other kinds of games t0tem, most people I know and play with want to play a game that has an ending. Telling somebody a game that they're about to play has no ending is a terrible idea, and generally is not conducive to garnering new players to the game, whatever it is.
From what I know of games, I feel it is important that you understand (you in the general, I am very slow to insult the intelligence or knowledge of any person) the difference between a Game Ending Mechanic and a Victory Mechanic.
Western board games typically incorporate the two into one. That is, the player that forces the Game Ending is also the victor. Think Sorry, Connect Four, Chess, Risk, etc. European games (barring a few notables) do not have that tendency.
That little spiel having been spilled, here's my understanding of basic Game Enders, NOT Victory Conditions.
1.) All other players are eliminated.
1a.) In a cooperative game, all enemies on the board have been eliminated.
2.) A designated number of turns have passed.
3.) A target location has been reached by either the player(s) or the game. This includes Capture the Flag-esque games, 13 Dead End Drive, and Chutes and Ladders.
4.) A target individual has been assassinated.
5.) In puzzle games, the mystery / riddle has been solved successfully.
Tue, 04/26/2011 - 14:32
#9
for sure its most likely a
for sure its most likely a bad idea. just fueling OP's mind fire.
Excellent ideas. Thanks for the help.
tomg