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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

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Tue, 09/27/2005 - 05:08
gpetersz
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Hi,

Some designers from here and I (as an artist) teamed up to finish some products what we plan to publish later.

I wonder what you all think guys (especially publishers visiting this site): What publishers like better: game ideas and designs. Or they might even accept (like) the idea of a fully finished (ready to print) product?

Will they want to use their own in-house artists or hire freelancers to REDO the art of such a product?

I ask theoretically (not our specific games).

I know that it might depend on the quality of art so:
http://www.beautyofbeast.com ->my portfolio

Without asking the respected designers, I can't show the works in progress. I'll ask them in mail and if they allow it and anybody is interested here I'll put something up to show.

So, I ask it at the moment theoretically.

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Tue, 09/27/2005 - 07:17
#1
JackDarwid
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Hi !
I want to know that myself (I'm not a publisher).

This is all I know till now :
- when Z man made a challenge here in BGDF, he strictly said that he only wanted the game idea (design), because he has artists in his side.
- in Steve Jackson Games submission page :
http://www.sjgames.com/general/guidelines/authors/card-board.html
says that they will do the art, unless you're good. And seeing Peter's art, I will say that Peter is good :)

That's from me
:)
Jack

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Tue, 09/27/2005 - 07:57
#2
gpetersz
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Hi Jack!

Every comment is welcomed!

Yes at SJG:

"# We don't expect the designer to do his own illustrations. When a designer tries to do so, we are usually horrified by the result. (Sometimes we're amused -- but not in a good way.) Okay, Tom Wham is an exception, but you're not Tom Wham. (If you are, in fact, Tom Wham, ignore that sentence. If you are not sure whether you are Tom Wham, check your drivers' license. If it says that you are Tom Wham, send us more games.)
# Likewise, you as the designer are not responsible for providing art. That's our problem. Your prototype does not need to have any art at all, and the maps and boards can be very crudely drawn as long as they're clear."

It only means (for me!): you don't have to, your game might be totally worthy for them without art. And: if you are not experienced PLEASE DO NOT DO ANY art. (unless you are Tom Wham).
I am not Tom Wham, but I am not the designer. :)
The designer gives the game, I illustrate it, and then we submit it!

(thanks for your words anyway! :) You know, at least I won't terrify them.)

I hope that Z-man games might reply to this topic...

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Tue, 09/27/2005 - 10:15
#3
Z-Man
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Joined: 01/01/2009
Re: Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished

gpetersz wrote:
Hi,

Some designers from here and I (as an artist) teamed up to finish some products what we plan to publish later.

I wonder what you all think guys (especially publishers visiting this site): What publishers like better: game ideas and designs. Or they might even accept (like) the idea of a fully finished (ready to print) product?

Will they want to use their own in-house artists or hire freelancers to REDO the art of such a product?

I ask theoretically (not our specific games).

I know that it might depend on the quality of art so:
http://www.beautyofbeast.com ->my portfolio

Without asking the respected designers, I can't show the works in progress. I'll ask them in mail and if they allow it and anybody is interested here I'll put something up to show.

So, I ask it at the moment theoretically.

****Personally, I would love to have a completed design with quality and appropriate artwork: it's less work for me and more time is saved. Plus costs are reduced - I don't have to hire artists and usually the deisgner includes the art in their deal with me. It's just it is very rare to find a designer who also has the skills or the network of artists to include good art in their design.

It doesn't hurt the design if it's accompanied by decent art, though I could see publishers automatically thinking negatively about your design if it has horrible art. And art is subjective so you have to watch out.

I've been to your site and your art is not bad - your newer pieces are better.

I have gotten many designs that included art, sometimes clip art to give some visual appeal to a prototype.

Hope this helps.

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Tue, 09/27/2005 - 10:19
#4
gpetersz
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Thanks a lot Zev! So if the art is good then it might be welcomed my publishers (probably other publishers think the same).

Otherwise with badly drawn images art could be a drawback.

(yes it might be hard to be a designer and artist, that's why I teamed up designers)

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Thu, 09/29/2005 - 05:17
#5
gpetersz
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Just to show more about the art being produced for the project and since I got the permission from Ken Maher the respected IP owner for Katt&Mowz cardgame to put cards into my porfolio, meaning: practically show off to the net, I linked an image showing the design and images from my site.

I have absolute trust in BGDF members, but for anyone finding this thread:

Everything about the game design, mechanism and rules are copyrighted by Ken Maher 2005, all the images and graphical design is copyrighted by Peter Szabo Gabor 2005 (me).

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Sun, 10/02/2005 - 18:04
#6
Anonymous
Supplying art with a game

I think that the designs look great and immediately allow the recipient to visualise much more than a simple card with a number on it.

We've just had The Da Vinci Game, thedavincigame.com, published and my wife, Allison did all the artwork for the board and playing pieces and they used it pretty much as was, they changed the designs for the cards a bit and wanted to do all the artwork for the box themselves.

We went with a firm called Games Talk and they did say that it would have been better if we'd sent it earlier, even in an unfinished state as then all of us could have worked on it together, however for this game the timescale was very important. They also offered us a good commission, which I have a feeling was reflected in the fact that we sent them a finished product and perhaps they'd have offered us less if the product needed more work.

Overall having seen some of the illustrations I'd say definitely include them and be willing to be flexible.

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Mon, 10/03/2005 - 02:18
#7
gpetersz
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Thanks for the reply Aminto! It was very valuable!
So actually this concept could work.

The question is, why they'd want to work together on the piece? To be able to pay less for the comission?

I think the advantage of the formula could be (I've got the % from these forums):

So the royalty received after a game sold for publishers could be 3-5% of the retail price. Besides the publisher has to spend a given amount (depends on the game's art need) of money on art (it might be some $1000) and the print costs. If we give it a fully finished game we could have 1-2% more (it is only an estimation) which might mean less cost for them on the art (less work on arranging the work, and no time spent on actually producing the art). Besides we could have a better royalty rate (or upfront payment). So it is better for us, and better for them (if it is calculated carefully).

Congratulations on the DaVinci game! Looks good, artwise, gamewise.

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Mon, 10/17/2005 - 16:51
#8
CardboardAddict
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Am I the only one around here that finds the statement of Steve Jackson games not really friendly. In my games, though I'm not a professional graphic artist, I always do focus on art as well as on the game itself, because I think a game is nowhere without it's theme and a theme is nowhere without art. Okay, this doesn't go for abstract games, but I don't design those. All the work I put in the art of a game would be concidered useless: "We don't even look at it. It's all crap" If you get my point. I don't agree with them, even a test version should look as nice as possible.

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Tue, 10/18/2005 - 09:27
#9
gpetersz
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Yes you are right about test versions. I found that most designers really DO care about the outlook of their prototype. Some of them can draw quite adequately, some of them uses clip-art to get the desired look.

On the other side... is it written that they regard it as crap?
I didn't feel that they were such unfriendly.

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Tue, 10/18/2005 - 11:34
#10
CardboardAddict
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Steve Jackson Games wrote:

"We don't expect the designer to do his own illustrations. When a designer tries to do so, we are usually horrified by the result. (Sometimes we're amused -- but not in a good way.)"

I don't know, maybe I did exaggerate (how would you spell that?) but I had been busy all week trying to finish up the illustrations for the test version of a little deduction game I am working on, and at that point, you don't want to hear someone saying they often laugh about those drawings. But your right, it's more wannabe-funny than it is unfriendly.

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Thu, 10/20/2005 - 05:48
#11
gpetersz
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Contacting a publisher with a fully (art-wise) finished game

Anyway, I guess they won't laugh at your art if that's good. They mention a guy who is good in both.

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