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Break My Game - "Never Seven" - Playtest Rules

3 replies [Last post]
Sat, 01/11/2025 - 16:58
Steve
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Joined: 07/29/2008

I am submitting my game here to see if it can be broken in a way that I can't break it through solo playtesting.

In summary, each player has 9 pieces. The pieces have a number on each side of them (like a coin): 1/2, 1/3 or 2/3. They place one of their pieces down while flipping over (and moving) one of their opponent's pieces. The first player to create the numerical value of seven with a line of pieces (horizontal, vertical or diagonal) loses.

My intent with this game is to create something:

** With hidden information (a certain % of chance is involved)
** That kids could play as well as adults
** It's something that is relatively quick resolving (game time is less than 10 minutes) with few pieces (18 in total, not counting the board)

The rules are almost written stream-of-conscious; They are not pretty and are not meant to be the final version but, hopefully, they are clear enough.

Thank you for your constructive feedback.

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Sat, 01/11/2025 - 21:34
#1
questccg
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Joined: 04/16/2011
I don't think this is "Breaking" the game but...

One of the simple observations is to learn that any Token in play opposite side is either one of two OTHER values. So if you understand this fact, you can probably elongate the game in terms of time. You say the game can be played in about 10 minutes.

While I have not TRIED this... My postulation to you is that a game can go on indefinitely if you understand some of the composition of the game. Like knowing that a token will have one of two OTHER values is a critical assertion.

So to avoid any trouble... You would move a piece say a "3" knowing that the opposite side is either a "1" or "2" (the only possible values). By KNOWING and OBSERVING this, you would move a piece that has no ramifications for scoring a "7". Meaning a situation where a "1" or "2" doesn't imply a "7".

Same goes on the start of a turn where you PLACE the topmost token into play. This is much easier to solve for since you KNOW the value and can compute the values when deciding where to PLACE that token.

So there are a total of 18 Turns (9 for each player before the piles exhaust).

Q: Is it your opinion that the game will END BEFORE all 18 Tokens are placed on the Board?

This would be good to know TBH. And if this is a END OF GAME signal (out of tokens to place), well then it could signify that if the end of the tokens are reached the game ends in a STALEMATE (maybe... It's just a thought).

It's not the end of the world if an ABSTRACT game such as yours doesn't end in a victory for either side. STALEMATES are more accepted in abstract games and since it is quick it is easy to play a re-match to see if you can beat the game again.

My second points is just that...

Is a STALEMATE or a game going on forever the sign that the game is BROKEN???

I would argue that the STALEMATE is a valid condition for cutting off the game prematurely. But that going of forever would signal some kind of "brokeness".

Last point about VALUES...

It's a bit too bad that the game relies on Numbers ONLY. It has a Rock-Paper-Scissors QUALITY to the game in that there are only "3" VALUES. Maybe the only way for this game to work is by NUMBERS... You could make the game look much more PRETTY if it was about FLOWERS.

Like Roses = "3", Tulips = "2" and Daisies = "1". You would STILL have the VALUE on the Token ... Just the GAME would look much MORE PRETTIER with the FLOWER BED instead of just numbers.

Roses could be "RED", Tulips could be "RED and YELLOW" and Daisies could be "WHITE and YELLOW". The numbers would still be on the TOKEN but the resulting FLOWER BED would be much more VIBRANT than just the numbers.

It doesn't AFFECT GAME PLAY... ONLY AESTHETICS in that the board will look much more colorful.

***

I haven't PLAYED per se... Just reading the rules and understanding the strategy and where to TAKE OUT (or REMOVE) Randomness with PREDICTABLE and DETERMINISTIC results.

The idea of the FLOWERS was to make the game feel more presentable even though it does NOTHING to "alter" the game (which could be a good fact too!)

For now that's the best that I have. Let me know if you have questions of your own and please reply and do the best to address my questions.

Sincerely.

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Sat, 01/11/2025 - 21:56
#2
X3M
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Joined: 10/28/2013
The line of 7? Does that mean

The line of 7?
Does that mean that 3-3-2-3 doesn't count. But when you flip the 2, and it becomes a 1. You get 3-3-1-3. And thus 3+3+1=7 and 3+1+3=7. I assume that the line doesn't count as a total of 10.

Seeing as how placing a third piece in a row is extremely dangerous. And flipping over a piece in a row that is at least 3 long. I assume that players will first make blocks of 2x2 that don't touch each other diagonally. In other words, I think that most games will have an empty + on the 5x5 grid. So, each player has placed 8 pieces so far. And that last piece will be a gamble piece.

Chances are that if there are 3-3-2-3-3 situations. And that 2 is knowingly a 3 on the other side. All a player has to do is keep flipping it over.
There, that is a broken portion.

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Sat, 01/11/2025 - 22:23
#3
questccg
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The board can change too...

X3M wrote:
Chances are that if there are 3-3-2-3-3 situations. And that 2 is knowingly a 3 on the other side. All a player has to do is keep flipping it over. There, that is a broken portion.

You don't know if the "2" is either a "1" or "3". It's the opponent's Tile. The first time you FLIP it you take a chance and can lose the game by being too "reckless". But yeah I agree there could be a situation where the risk is 0% that the operation of moving and flipping does NOT result in a "7" 100% of the time.

I also think that the game should END if a player CANNOT place a Tile into play WITHOUT causing a "7". Should be the rule: You can't play, you lose. You were outsmarted by your opponent. Also the END should be when the tiles you have are expended. That's more than 2/3rd of the board and it should be a STALEMATE giving both players a chance to RESET and TRY AGAIN.

I'm still curious as what you mean by BROKEN?! By your rules or the game itself, etc. etc. What exactly do you mean by "Break my game"???

Note #1: I think there is a MISTAKE in your RULEBOOK. It says 3 1/3 and again repeats 3 1/3. I think the first one should be 3 1/"2" instead. Like in your Original Post (OP). Should be 3x 1/2, 3x 1/3 and 3x 2/3 tokens. That sounds more logical and fixes the BUG in the rulebook.

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