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Map Patrols

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Wed, 01/12/2022 - 17:53
treeves3
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I'm working on a map where characters can explore and get harassed by roving patrols. Characters start on Green, then can move from 0-4 spaces each turn. Moving 2 or more spaces creates noise in all directions (1 noise for 2 movement, 2 noise for 3, and 3 noise for 4). Characters who move 3 or 4 are also considered running, and can only keep up this pace for two turns before having to rest by moving only 0 or 1 space. The goal of the characters is to explore the various black numbered locations on the map (each offering different choices, story narrative, skill checks, and rewards). Blue spaces reduce character noise and the patrol's LOS by one.

The patrol's turn begins by drawing two cards from a deck. The deck is comprised of numbers (matching the red square spawn points on the map) and letters (matching the red round destination points on the map), as well as Fast (all patrols move +1 this turn) and Slow (all patrols move -1 this turn) cards. If a letter is drawn and there is no token on the board that matches that letter, then that card is simply discarded and ignored. However, if there IS a matching token, then that token is replaced with a token drawn from the bag (thus changing the patrol's destination, making the patrols far less predictable).

[Example: Spawn 1 is drawn from the patrol deck. The A patrol token is drawn from the token bag and placed on the square Spawn 1 space. Then the A token moves three spaces towards red destination point A. (Any other patrol tokens currently on the board move 3 spaces closer to their destinations too.) On turn 2, the A card is drawn. from the patrol deck The E token is drawn from the bag, replacing the A token on the board. The E token moves 3 spaces towards red destination point E (and again, all other patrol tokens move towards their destinations as well.)]

If a patrol moves within two adjacent spaces to a character, or moves over a noise token (created when characters move 2 or more spaces), then the patrol makes that character their new destination.

Overall, there are some pros and cons to this system...

THE GOOD: The mix of escalating patrols with new spawns, patrols changing speed and direction, etc., make for some pretty tense moments where characters have to run for their lives, hide, and sometimes get caught.

THE BAD: After card draws and swapping destinations, as more patrols enter the board, each one has to move towards their specific destination. Because the maps are big (I could only upload about 1/3 of one side of the full map due to pic size limitations), there are patrol units that are quite far away from any character that must still swap or move each turn. Though simple enough, it is still tedious with no real point to move these patrols. Also, when congested, some characters must "hide" (usually on a blue space), and wait for patrols to clear out before exploring again. This can result in several stuck characters with idle turns, depending on circumstance. Additionally, the bulk of time is spent drawing patrol cards and moving patrol units (rather than player's moving their own tokens).

Here is one possible solution I've considered...

SOLUTION 1: To alleviate inconsequential patrols being managed that are out of range, I could break each map into sectors, with different decks and draw bags managing each sector. These sectors would only activate when a character enters them. The downside: more components (up to six decks, and six draw bags) to setup and manage. And it does nothing to alleviate idle turns where a character is stuck hiding waiting for patrols to pass.

Any other thoughts you can suggest to streamline this system?

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Wed, 01/12/2022 - 19:11
#1
questccg
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What if you were a TEAM of escapees?

This way each player could CONTROL three (3) Prisoners and if one is stuck waiting for a patrol to pass him/her by, the other two units can move more easily because they have the "APs" (Action Points) to do further since there is one less unit to worry about (since that one is waiting for the patrol to vacate).

I didn't exactly understand all "THE BAD" ... But that's my "stab-in-the-dark" so to speak!

Maybe someone else might have other ideas. That's all I could come up with ATM.

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Wed, 01/12/2022 - 20:18
#2
terzamossa
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The game looks cool! I think

The game looks cool!
I think dividing in sectors is a good idea, maybe you just have to find a tidier way to do it?

e.g. all sectors could have the same target points: There is one A point in each sector, although the different A points are positioned in different ways according to the sector. So a single deck of cards can move patrols all over the map?

Probably there are more little tweaks in this direction that could be made, I didn't understand everything of how the game is played (and anyway wouldn't understand the nuance without actually playing it) but maybe some more steps can be simplified. At a glance, changing token A for token E when something happens, sounds a bit like a pain, I'd rather have token A keep its direction until point A and then just disappear. So I guess you would only need tokens with letters and a deck with number? if you get E and 3, token E spawns on point 3 and will start moving towards point E.
Maybe I took it too far and the result is boring, it's quite likely :) you can ignore the specific example, my main point is to simplify everything that can be simplified until playtesting shows that the system is too simple. This may shorten the time related to the patrol management and increase the time players take to plan and execute their actions (also as they could foresee more of what is happening)

If you simplify movement a lot, you may add complexity in other directions? Maybe some simple kind of combat, or collecting resources to open pathways, but maybe this is not the direction you want this to take!

Good luck in any case!

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Wed, 01/12/2022 - 20:27
#3
treeves3
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Thanks for taking a stab at

Thanks for taking a stab at it! Each player will control from 1 to N characters, and characters will group in teams. But there's no global pool of Action Points - each team gets up to 4 movement. There is almost always some team movement somewhere, but some teams will take longer to progress than others depending on patrol circumstances.

However, you sparked an idea.

One problem I was thinking was that every team needed to cross the river and be together on the other side to trigger the end game sequence. But if the first team triggers the end game, then all other teams simply catch up for the finale (potentially leaving unexplored sections due to time constraints). I can actually picture that cinematically and it would make sense in the broader scheme of things.

Thanks for your inspiration!

-Tom

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Wed, 01/12/2022 - 23:02
#4
treeves3
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@Terzamossa: I'll have to

@Terzamossa: I'll have to explore this idea: "There is one A point in each sector, although the different A points are positioned in different ways according to the sector. So a single deck of cards can move patrols all over the map?"

It gives me only one deck to work through, which is good, but adds multiple "A" tokens, "B" tokens, etc. to the draw bag. So when "A" in Sector 1 is supposed to swap, it's possible under this method that you could draw another "A" token meant for Sector 2, rather than something that would change A's direction in Sector 1. Thematically, that could represent a patrol considering turning down a different path, but deciding, "Nah, I'll just stay the course." Hmmm. I kind of like that!

The reason for the swap is to occasionally redirect some tokens, which adds a level of unpredictability and spice. If you always know where patrols are going, it's too easy to completely avoid them with no surprises. But if you add the swap mechanic, you get something like this:

The patrol seems to be going West towards the old barn, but then, just as you cut into the open, they turn and head East, spotting you... Run!

Those are good, unpredictable moments I don't want to lose. If I can narrow the focus (by including sector mechanics like your idea) and streamline a bit, it may be a workable system.

Thanks,
Tom

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Wed, 01/12/2022 - 23:45
#5
Juzek
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So, is this a system that is

So, is this a system that is trying to be apart from any one particular story?

For instance, it would be nice in your final version if point 04 is always a barn to make it look like one.

For your moving patrols, you mentioned having a deck, and determining the direction and speed for patrols. This sounds a little fiddley, where there is too much to keep track of, and takes players out of the game.

Have you considered a die roll? It would be:
(1) truly unpredictable and random.
(2) extra tense for the moment of reveal
(3) be able to handle some rudimentary events simply (such as adding patrols)

Consider this: For each line, add an arrow head on one side, and make some large loops, this would be the direction the patrol goes. Either use numbers or pip marks on the locations the patrols stand. They move forward to the next space that matches the dice roll. If you had more 1's and 2's in the loop, they would move a shorter distance. If you only had a few 6's, they would sprint in terrifying fashion to the next space thats a 6, endangering everything in-between.

You could have loops that have entrances from other parts of the map, so that at the beginning of the game, there is only one patrol in the loop, but partway through another patrol has joined in the loop, and now there are two patrols.

I would recommend keeping the same number of patrols on the board in loops, you just don't know how much ground they would cover. But you can always have one-way paths, and whenever the number on the start of the path is rolled, spawn a patrol there.

I really like the organic feel of your board

-Doug

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Sat, 01/15/2022 - 12:03
#6
treeves3
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Rough Draft

@Juzek: The map is a rough draft only - eventually I will have an artist make the map to include barns and other details. And eventually, I will be adding more maps with many different event locations, different player goals, buildings, landscapes, etc.

The deck system was chosen because it allows a balance of predictability (which players require to make it across heavily patrolled areas), while adding occasional unpredictability for spice. I can also design and control the general flow of a deck (how many "Add Patrol" cards for each sector, how frequently guards speed up or slow down or individuals change direction, etc., without players knowing exactly WHEN those events will occur due to the shuffle) - whereas dice are completely random, such that players could roll three ones in a row (or three sixes), more or less destroying the patrol's chance to act rationally is some swingy instances. That's not what I'm after for this particular aspect of the game.

For example, if I have a dozen or more patrols on the board (which can happen depending on number of characters in various sectors), it is much more fiddly and disruptive to roll 12 dice, assign each to a patrol, move them accordingly, etc., than it is to draw one or two cards. If I only roll one die for all 12 patrols, that is less disruptive, but then you have ALL patrols turning in the same direction (say, West) at the same time like a flock of birds, and that's not what I'm after either. The deck method allows for one or two card draws (maybe per sector) per turn with minimal disruption to game flow. Disruptions become the exception, not the rule. The deck can also accommodate unusual rare events that I might want to trigger on one map, but not on others.

I do appreciate your feedback here, but designing dice into this part of my game isn't the right fit for what I have in mind.

Thanks,
Tom

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Sun, 01/16/2022 - 19:19
#7
questccg
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I thought I had read somewhere...

That this was ONLY a preview (portion of the map) since you couldn't get the file to be smaller in file size. My recommendation is to save a LARGER file as a JPEG image file. And lower the quality to 50 (in the middle). That should allow you to UPLOAD a larger portion of the MAP in the event that you have additional area you want to share with the group.

It's not like I don't think the present map image is not enough... But I kind of remember reading you mentioning that you could upload more (in terms of the map).

Anyways ... You can TRY a JPEG (with 50 in the middle quality) and it should be much smaller too. Also I think your image is LARGE in SIZE, you can maybe shrink it by 50% (evenly) and that too will lower the overall size of the FILE you will be uploading!

Just some suggestions, in the event you want to share more of the map with us!

Cheers.

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Mon, 01/17/2022 - 11:13
#8
treeves3
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Larger Map

The rest of the map is mostly more of the same at this point. Once I flesh out the mechanics, I'll spend more time detailing each location. At that point I might share the larger map with the community to get their feedback.

Thanks,
Tom

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Mon, 01/17/2022 - 14:40
#9
questccg
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Okay ... no worries

BTW would you be OPEN to a GENERATED MAP??? WHY? So that the game can be fresh each time you play it... HOW? Well I was thinking about "clear plastic cards" like this:

https://www.thegamecrafter.com/make/products/ClearEuroPokerDeck

And you would SPREAD them across the board like a RANDOM PILE of cards... Of course they all connect and such.

But it could make for a MESS of a board which could be something I've never SEEN BEFORE! Players create the MAP first by drawing cards and placing in the GAME AREA (on the board).

Why the TRANSPARENCY you ask??? Well it's just so that multiple cards can STACK and not cut-off any paths that may be connecting a layer or two down (beneath).

Just an idea. Cheers!

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Wed, 01/19/2022 - 10:53
#10
treeves3
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Spiral Book

@questccg... This story-driven game will use a spiral book full of artistic maps (think Sleeping Gods - only with much more landscape variety for each map location). But thanks for thinking outside the box!

-Tom

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Wed, 01/19/2022 - 17:46
#11
questccg
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Ah okay... I just thought this was a "static" board

With all that talk about making a more eye-catching board... I thought that's what you will be designing. Ah I get the "spiral book" endeavor. Wishing you all the best of success in this project. It takes a lot of effort to put the adventure together in such a "book" format.

I was going to say more like "Space Kraken" which is an adventure in a spiral bound book also...

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/3dartlab/space-kraken/description

Anyhow have fun with the project... Cheers!

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