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Monster Keep — Take our POLL!

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Wed, 11/21/2018 - 20:43
questccg
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Please VOTE in regards to this POLL about "Monster Keep":

https://www.bgdf.com/poll/monster-keep-%E2%80%94-what-kind-units-should-...

Not to repeat the poll's content... Just something to do with "THEME" and "CONTENT"... What designers think would work best.

Also feel free to add comments to this thread in the event you have questions, concerns or feedback.

Cheers everyone!

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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 04:12
#1
Tim Edwards
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I voted monsters only. As i

I voted monsters only.

As i see it, we are catching and contolling monsters, which is possible because they are...monsters. Strong but maybe lacking the heroic qualities of imagination, ideology, loyalty, etc...

I think of the cave trolls in Lord of the rings...you couldn't use heroic Celtic Giants in quite the same way. In DnD speak: your game really seems to lend itself to chaotic and natural alignments. There's no place for the Lawful here! :)

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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 15:19
#2
questccg
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Ugh... That pains me to hear

Yeah I know it makes more sense to have ... Monsters ... in "Monster Keep"!

I had all these categories of units, 90 to be exact. And now I'm realizing that all of that is pure "crap"! Why? Because a lot of them are NOT "Monsters". I would need to re-define the sub-categories. Those units come from another game that I had been working on called "Crystal Heroes"!

It's just me being very lazy! (LOL) If I can't sub-categorize "Monsters", well then I'm not sure how keep track about all of these cards/units.

TBD, you've given me more to think about...

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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 16:17
#3
let-off studios
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My Thoughts

I also voted "Monsters Only."

You ought to clarify:

  • Players are heroes trying to defeat monsters by visiting the Monster Keep, OR
  • Players are monsters trying to defeat heroes who are infiltrating their fortress and trying to steal loot and/or kidnap fellow monsters, OR
  • You're a powerful "collector" of different life forms, and either Monsters or Heroes are good enough for you, as long as they're unique specimens. It's likely you'll need to change the game name to reflect this, though... The upshot is that the broadest allowance of artwork would qualify for this version.
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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 19:51
#4
questccg
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Well that's two for one!

let-off studios wrote:
You ought to clarify.

Player's are "Masters" attempting to become "The Master of the Keep" through a sign of superior combat and spell abilities. The "Masters" control their garrison of "Monsters" they summon to help combat the opposition.

Two important things:

  1. I want to KEEP (Pun intended!) the game name as "Monster Keep".

  2. I also want to KEEP (Pun 2x) the "Keeping" (or capture) of opposing Monsters.

That addresses what I believe is to be really UNIQUE about the game. Otherwise it's just "another" Battle Card Game. Which is why I want it to stand out and am seeking to include novel mechanics and varying gameplay.

By remove point #2 (Keeping the opposing Monsters), you lose the feel for the original game and then I agree that point #1 is not really that important (in that context). Then it becomes finding another name for this Battle Arena game.

So I'm waiting for more feedback... But I THINK that what you both have said is that "IF the game is going to be CALLED 'Monster Keep' and in the game you 'get to keep the Monsters' ... it make 100% to only design for the various Monsters..." (and not include Heroes).

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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 20:12
#5
questccg
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A follow-up question(?)

Before I had nine (9) Races/Factions:

  1. Humans — Holy
  2. High Elves — Life
  3. Dwarves — Storm
  4. Gnomes — Technology
  5. Wood Elves — Earth
  6. Dark Elves — Chaos
  7. Undead — Death
  8. Giants — Frost
  9. Orcs — Fire

Now while I think this "carry-over" from "Crystal Heroes" is very detailed and "fleshed-out" ... As we have all been saying it is NOT appropriate for "Monster Keep"

So here is my next question:

"How do I categorize the 'Monsters' in the game?"

Generally speaking there needs a way to order them other than just random monsters on varying cards.

Ideas???

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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 21:24
#6
Tim Edwards
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questccg wrote:Before I had

questccg wrote:
Before I had nine (9) Races/Factions:

1. Humans — Holy
2. High Elves — Life
3. Dwarves — Storm
4. Gnomes — Technology
5. Wood Elves — Earth
6. Dark Elves — Chaos
7. Undead — Death
8. Giants — Frost
9. Orcs — Fire

Now while I think this "carry-over" from "Crystal Heroes" is very detailed and "fleshed-out" ... As we have all been saying it is NOT appropriate for "Monster Keep"

So here is my next question:

__"How do I categorize the 'Monsters' in the game?"__

Generally speaking there needs a way to order them other than just random monsters on varying cards.

Ideas???

How many categories do you need?

If you need 9, it shouldn't be too hard. Without knowing what's in your menagerie of whether you want to categorise them by habitat, class, or some other way, I can suggest as possibilities...

Goblinoids
Reptilians
Undead
Gargantuans
Demonoids
Elementals/ inc golems
Cursed Beasts (Minotaur, Medusa, chimera...mutants that looks like they might have been made by some evil power)
Enchanted beasts (nice looking things sadly misused in this unholy battle: unicorn, Pegasus, griffon)
Shadows

I mean, that could be a sort of taxonomy, but if you had a strong lore attached, you might make it about regions, the firey mountains, the ancient forest, and scorched plains, the sunless sea (credit Coleridge for that one), etc

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Thu, 11/22/2018 - 22:53
#7
questccg
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Do you think you can help me complete this???

Monster Keep v5.0 - Monster Listing

This is a PDF document with 8 categories in which I have filled all of the categories.

Anyone else have ideas, that too would be great...

Take a look and tell me what you think?!

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Fri, 11/23/2018 - 15:12
#8
Tim Edwards
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A couple of possible

A couple of possible celestials to fill the gaps:

Faun
Pheonix

EDIT

Ah, just noticed Pheonix is already " Cursed." :)
I'll think further on that one...

EDIT AGAIN

Sphinx?

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Fri, 11/23/2018 - 17:04
#9
questccg
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Cool beans...

Thanks @Tim, I went with:

  • Will-o-wisp
  • Thunderbird

I had the "Thunderbird" from before... A Lightning/Storm generating bird. In spirit similar to the Phoenix ... but instead of Fire, it's Lightning...

And I wanted a "weak-ish" card that can use the "Multiply 3" Powerword. Each round the wisp gains +1/+1 to a maximum of 4/4 as a stronger unit.

Good stuff!

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Sat, 11/24/2018 - 18:11
#10
questccg
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Bump!

Just bumping this thread to hopefully increase the number of VOTER!

Please check out the POLL and let me know you feelings/pov...

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Mon, 11/26/2018 - 21:25
#11
questccg
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Bump #2!

Figured I'd bump this thread a second time... Since we've only got about 4 votes ... And we probably got a dozen or so regulars!

Please check out the POLL in the Original Post (OP) at the very top of this thread! Many thanks.

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Tue, 11/27/2018 - 15:41
#12
let-off studios
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Slimes etc.

Any chance there's room in your budget to commission artwork for slimes, molds, jellies, and assorted amorphous monsters? Maybe fungus-based creatures? I saw none of those in your current menagerie. You can also go with some strange humanoid races as well, even lending an otherworldly/extra-dimensional flair to the artwork. That kind of thing would make it different from the orcs and ogres you already have included, and at the same time keep them from being confused as potential Heroes.

If you're a fan of old-skool D&D, you may recall the githyanki and githzerai. There are plenty more but those are the two that come to mind. Humanoid in appearance, but almost unmistakably alien and from another world. Not to say you need to copy them specifically, but the general idea is what I was trying to bring across.

Additionally, if you're looking for additional monster types, I think Thunderstone did an admirable job of determining different classifications. The expansions were astonishing in the amount of diverse content, in my opinion.

For info on Thunderstone:
https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/53953/thunderstone

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Tue, 11/27/2018 - 21:52
#13
questccg
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More units required

let-off studios wrote:
Any chance there's room in your budget to commission artwork for slimes, molds, jellies, and assorted amorphous monsters?

I'd be interested ... Here is the list of Monsters that I have DRAFTED:

1: Slug
2: Slime
3: Ooze
4: Blob
5: Amoeba
6: Swarm
7: Jelly
8: Polymorph
9: Changeling
10: Luminous Dragon

let-off studios wrote:
Maybe fungus-based creatures? I saw none of those in your current menagerie.

Nine (9) categories of Monsters is enough. I currently have eight (8) which are offset and balanced by the opposite forces, but having one "in-the-middle" would be cool...

I did some research about "Thunderstone" and well there are 60 units in the game. Currently I have 80 and with 10 more would be 90... This is a bit high in terms of artwork. But I'll see. The idea is to ensure that the design is solid and then I can see how I can transform it into a reality. It's not like I bet everything on cost/analysis... I do leave room for some creativity (knowing it may cost me more to accomplish).

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Wed, 11/28/2018 - 23:50
#14
questccg
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What do you think of this "short list"???

@Let-off what are your thoughts on the DRAFT/Short list of "Amorphous" Monsters?

I'd like to know if you have OTHER "creative" ideas for the list...

I personally like the "Swarm" which could be a "collective" or "grouping" of the other Monsters. Still thinking about this category. I wish I had a BETTER term than "Amorphous" thought(?!)

Tell me your thoughts on this matter... Ideas about the Group Name???

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Thu, 11/29/2018 - 23:52
#15
Fri
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Sorry for the late reply. So

Sorry for the late reply.

So I voted for hero's and monsters. With the perspective of why limit your design space. I will admit that from a marketing point of view you guys make good points.

There still may be room for a heroic concept in MK. I'm thinking those monster that are labeled a heroic can be captured by your opponent, but your opponent cannot coerce heroic monster to fight for them. Maybe loyal would be a better term.

Just out of curiosity, can you recapture that have been captured by your opponent?

Good luck with your game.

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Fri, 11/30/2018 - 00:38
#16
questccg
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The topic is still "open"... I'm still interested in feedback!

Fri wrote:
Just out of curiosity, can you recapture that have been captured by your opponent?

Yes it is possible. But it requires two (2) factors:

1. The Monster in question must be "exhausted" which means he was used during the round.

2. You must attack and "defeat" the Monster and then instead of sending the Monster to that player's Exile, he goes on the Top of your Micro deck.

Fri wrote:
Good luck with your game.

Thanks and thank you for your input. It's still very much a Work-In-Progress (WIP). But so far, I am happy with the direction.

Cheers!

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