I've been trying to make board games for a long time. One problem I have with the computer is that since my Paint program is broken (does anyone know where I can download it again, it thinks my paint is deleted or something) I can only make games as far as I know in Excel or Word, using tables that make just square spaces. Anyway I look at like the 12 Disciples board and think, "Wow that's way cooler than my board." Anyway does anyone have any tips? Like get a Paint program (okay that was really bad, there goes the dream of being a stand up comic).
How do you draw those cool maps?
Fri, 08/20/2004 - 17:51
Fri, 08/20/2004 - 18:17
#1
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
snipy3 wrote:
One problem I have with the computer is that since my Paint program is broken (does anyone know where I can download it again, it thinks my paint is deleted or something)
Take a look at the GnuWin project at http://gnuwin.epfl.ch/en/.
It's a a collection of open source free software ported to windows. The collection includes GIMP in the graphics section. GIMP is one of the best image editing and drawing programs around, and it's free.
Jason
Fri, 08/20/2004 - 18:39
#2
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
Oracle wrote:
GIMP is one of the best image editing and drawing programs around, and it's free.
I actually Dloaded GIMP the other day... and started playing around with it. I had some trouble last night though... I have 1 file (jpg) with the game board from All For One scaled down to the size of a playing card. But what I really want is just the web of locations... I have another file now with the layers seperated out (psd) and I went into that and tried to Select All, Scale down to the right size, then copy and paste into the first file (which I had other layers with other stuff on).
It didn't work. Not even a little bit.
What's the deal? Can anyone help me use this program??
Fri, 08/20/2004 - 20:20
#3
How do you draw those cool maps?
What exactly is it you're trying to do? Just scale down the board?
Anyways, I use Photoshop to make my graphics.
This is a part of a modular board that I made using Photoshop. Takes me maybe about 20 to 30 minutes to make one of these.
I'd be happy to provide a service to people who want boards made, but for a small price.
Fri, 08/20/2004 - 22:12
#5
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
sedjtroll wrote:
Oracle wrote:GIMP is one of the best image editing and drawing programs around, and it's free.
I actually Dloaded GIMP the other day... and started playing around with it. I had some trouble last night though... I have 1 file (jpg) with the game board from All For One scaled down to the size of a playing card. But what I really want is just the web of locations... I have another file now with the layers seperated out (psd) and I went into that and tried to Select All, Scale down to the right size, then copy and paste into the first file (which I had other layers with other stuff on).
It didn't work. Not even a little bit.
What's the deal? Can anyone help me use this program??
The GIMP has a very steep learning curve. For simple resizes you'd probably do well to download the shareware version of PaintShop Pro and use it.
-Darke
Sat, 08/21/2004 - 07:36
#6
How do you draw those cool maps?
Try going to adobe.com or macromedia.com and download some trial graphics apps. They both offer their programs cripple free for 30 days so you can try and buy. It might be worth it just to get the 30 days out of the product.
Sat, 08/21/2004 - 08:27
#7
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
snipy3 wrote:
I've been trying to make board games for a long time. One problem I have with the computer is that since my Paint program is broken (does anyone know where I can download it again, it thinks my paint is deleted or something) I can only make games as far as I know in Excel or Word, using tables that make just square spaces. Anyway I look at like the 12 Disciples board and think, "Wow that's way cooler than my board." Anyway does anyone have any tips? Like get a Paint program (okay that was really bad, there goes the dream of being a stand up comic).
Can you give me a link to show me the Disciples Board you are talking about. If it's actually a map I can recommend 2-3 pieces of software, but they all have a learning curve.
You probably don't want to make anything other than room maps in Photoshop, as there are tools specifically designed to do maps that work better. You design in them and THEN bring them into Photoshop.
Sat, 08/21/2004 - 08:38
#8
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
snipy3 wrote:
Anyway I look at like the 12 Disciples board and think, "Wow that's way cooler than my board."
Trust me, I have the least art skills of anyone here, so if I can do it, you can do it! If you look at the Disciples board, for example, you'll see it's almost entirely rectangular boxes, circles, and text boxes. There is one sloping, irregular line representing the coastline, but other than that, there's very little to it. I made that map in a very simple Mac draw application, but the "Drawing" menu in Word or Excel should have the same options available. (I have had some problems in the past getting "text boxes" to be distinct from the text itself; PowerPont is a little easier to use).
One method I've found when I want to reproduce a more detailed map is to get a .jpg of the land form I want and then to "trace" over it using one of the drawing tools. It requires a steady hand and some practice and patience, but the drawing tool I use lets you modify the shape afterwards so it's pretty forgiving.
For a prototype, the maps don't really have to be gorgeous, although it doesn't hurt -- you do want players to want to like the game, after all! I usually use simple, solid colors, and try to make the board as uncluttered as possible. Cards are the same way; the key is not really the visual appeal, so much as the organized presentation of information in a clear and usable way. I'm no graphic artist, so if I can do it, so can you!
Good luck!
Sat, 08/21/2004 - 09:26
#9
How do you draw those cool maps?
What type of maps are you trying to do? General land mass/caves that are comprised of a lot of randomness are usually fairly by applying a bunch of filters in Photoshop and require virtually no drawing ability. Things that are little more structured, such as the floor tiles above, are a little bit tougher, but still doable since they are effectively, shaded squares. They just take some more time to do.
Sat, 08/21/2004 - 17:42
#10
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
VeritasGames wrote:
You probably don't want to make anything other than room maps in Photoshop, as there are tools specifically designed to do maps that work better. You design in them and THEN bring them into Photoshop.
I wouldn't say that you only want to make room maps in photoshop. I made this one this morning in Photoshop. The only filters I used were on the water. This was my first try at doing an outdoor type of map, so there's room for improvement, but really you can do anything in Photoshop.
It took me less than an hour to do this, but if there's programs out there to help with this kind of stuff, I'd like to see em, cause I'd definitely be able to use them.
Sat, 08/21/2004 - 22:13
#12
How do you draw those cool maps?
I agree there, that's a must. Most of my game artwork is created in 300 dpi, but some of the illustrations were scanned in at 600 dpi. Makes for some large files though.
Sun, 08/22/2004 - 11:14
#13
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
OldScratch wrote:
I wouldn't say that you only want to make room maps in photoshop. I made this one this morning in Photoshop. The only filters I used were on the water. This was my first try at doing an outdoor type of map, so there's room for improvement, but really you can do anything in Photoshop.
There are programs that can do that quality of work or better with a lot less Photoshop skills than you probably have.
I thought your work was excellent, but I guess the point is that I suspect that if the original poster had the kind of Photoshop skills you had then he wouldn't be asking the question he asked.
Consider that this can be done with no Photoshop skill in a few minutes with ProFantasy's Fractal Terrains:
http://www.profantasy.com/Products/ft/clouds_big.jpg
You can do similar stuff with or without clouds in Wilbur.
Similarly, with a little more practice KPT Bryce or alternately Terragen can do outrageously cool stuff. They can do continent view maps, but they can also do close up terrain images:
http://www.planetside.co.uk/terragen/gallery/gallerymain.php
For city, room, or dungeon maps I recommend all of Profantasy's fine software:
Here're some lists (perhaps out-of-date) of some nice terrain generation programs:
http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/~jslayton/terrain.html
http://www.terrasource.net/#surface
I think, in general, any map generated with these software packages is best after Photoshop touch-ups, but they allow you to get an awful lot of detail quickly without being a serious artist.
Sun, 08/22/2004 - 15:36
#14
Re: How do you draw those cool maps?
VeritasGames wrote:
Similarly, with a little more practice KPT Bryce or alternately Terragen can do outrageously cool stuff. They can do continent view maps, but they can also do close up terrain images:
Yeah I thought about using Bryce before, but I don't like how it renders. Compared to other renderers today, Bryce rendering doesn't look as "natural".
The ProFantasy stuff really looks great, though. I'll definitely be using that program. I'd still like a more natural looking render, but maybe that's something that can be fixed in Photoshop.
Though Dungeon Designer looks good for making maps for RPG games, I wouldn't use it for a dungeon crawler where people want more detail on the boards themselves.
Thanks for the links! You've helped me out a ton.
Sun, 08/22/2004 - 17:40
#16
How do you draw those cool maps?
I'm a graphic designer, so I have Photoshop along with other various tidbits of software that I've needed over the years. The ProFantasy stuff looks pretty good and isn't way too expensive, like 40 bucks. I have downloaded Expression but haven't installed yet. OpenCanvas is also another free alternative to Photoshop. Also, if any of you are students, Adobe offers a less expensive version of Photoshop (for about 100 bucks I think).
Sun, 08/22/2004 - 17:42
#17
How do you draw those cool maps?
Here's another thumbs up for Profantasy's stuff, although they too have something of a learning curve.
I really love Fractal Terrains for generating some amazingly convincing coastlines.
Mon, 08/23/2004 - 08:28
#18
How do you draw those cool maps?
CaptKevMan wrote:
You folks sure are talking about a lot of high-dollar software! Does everyone have Photoshop or Bryce or Illustrator or whatever? I'm presuming most people can't afford most of that software, which is why I posted the link to the FREE Expression from Microsoft.
Actually some of the rendering software I posted about was totally free. I think Wilbur and Terragen are free.
If you need free software then I'd recommend:
http://www.freeserifsoftware.com/
Other people may have mentioned GIMP (which I believe is also free isn't it, and powerful, though a bit hard to use from what I've heard).
You can find Paintshop Pro 7 for $45.00 or so.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00005NCJ3/103-8008955-2473420
Re: the Profantasy stuff, is generally under $100.00 and sometimes under $50.00
I'd say that I've thus far posted a wide range of software for different prices, as have others.
Tue, 08/24/2004 - 09:02
#21
How do you draw those cool maps?
CaptKevMan wrote:
I'm trying to stay out of the gray area and in the green zone here. ;)
What legal issues are you talking about? Most of the free software people have mentioned here is software designed and supported by 'net groups or is freely distributed by the manufacturer.
Everything else posted that I've recognized at least costs money.
Nobody is talking about illegal software give-aways are they? Or did I miss something.
If you are talking about the "www.freeserifsoftware.com" page, try actually reading the page. Serif Software itself operates the page and gives away software 3-4 revisions old so that they can hook you on their software and talk you into buying an upgrade.
Or are you talking about something else?
Tue, 08/24/2004 - 10:14
#22
...
I think he was just trying to make sure no one got the impression that any one here advocated the use of pirated software. A lot of the software packages mentioned here are very expensive; Photoshop, Illustrator, Freehand, etc can run anywhere from $250 to $500 *each*. A person perusing the board might not know each person's situation. I.E. they might not know that so and so is a Graphic Artist and that's why they have all that expensive software, or so and so is using student versions, or so and so bought an older version off of E-bay for cheap. Let's face it, it is not likely that the majority of people will have thousands of dollars worth of software for their personal use, so I think Kev was right to post a little 'disclaimer'. In this modern day age of keeping up with the Jones, folks might assume that it's ok for them to go grab pirated software, especially if they assume 'everyone is doing it'.
Good call Kev!
-Darke
Microsoft is offering a FREE application called Expression, which has vector (like Illustrator) and raster (like Photoshop) tools, at this location:
http://www.microsoft.com/products/expression/default.asp?pg=home
It's a lot closer to professional-level applications like Photoshop and Illustrator than the free stuff like Paint. It has a bit of a learning curve, but it would be well worth it for the quality difference.